Install Engine With Trans, or Engine Then Trans?

[Racer X]

Having worked as a journeyman mechanic for 30 years, I have changed out hundreds of engines, transmissions, and differentials, in all manner of machinery and vehicles. The process is pretty much the same, be it a tractor, car, heavy truck or trailer mounted equipment.

Most important is good planning beforehand, selection of quality tooling, and having enough room and an organized work area.

Reasons for removing (and subsequently reinstalling) an engine or transmission separately might be that one requires repair or maintenance, while the other doesn't, or, when performing a full restoration of a car. Then it makes sense to join the engine and transmission before installing them in the car. I even dress the engine fully before dropping it in to reduce the amount of time spent bending over the fenders afterwards.

I lost count of how many times I have removed and replaced the engine in my race Z, but the last time was after the crankshaft broke. Nothing wrong with the transmission, so I rigged up a way to hold the front of it, and pulled the engine only. 

Soon, I will be pulling the engine and transmission from my brown 72 Z. I will be pulling them together, as the engine needs a rebuild, and the transmission (an automatic) won't be going back in. And when I reinstall everything, it will most likely be as a unit.

So there isn't really a right or wrong way to remove and install these things, provided it is done safely. 

 

 

 

 

[Racer X]

I guess I should also mention that the poll needs a third choice.

“Choose the method that best suits the goal. If only the engine or transmission need to be removed for repairs, remove that item separately. If the reason for removal includes repairs to both, or work on the chassis requires the removal of both, pull them as a single unit.”

 

Edited October 9, 2020 by Racer X

[siteunseen]

I did not know we could do member polls. Maybe I shouldn't have known.

Let the polling begin!

[Mark Maras]

4 hours ago, Racer X said:

I guess I should also mention that the poll needs a third choice.

“Choose the method that best suits the goal. If only the engine or transmission need to be removed for repairs, remove that item separately. If the reason for removal includes repairs to both, or work on the chassis requires the removal of both, pull them as a single unit.”

 

 I agree.  Any of the three ways are a piece of cake compared to removing and replacing those parts on most cars.

[pogden]

I understood the original question to be "If both engine and transmission are out, is it better to install the engine and transmission as a unit, or drop the engine in first and then the transmission". In that case I would always do them as a unit unless something (maneuvering room, availability of a leveler) prevents it. If only the engine or the transmission needs to be removed, then yeah, only remove that - no need to remove both just to service one. 

[Patcon]

28 minutes ago, pogden said:

I understood the original question to be "If both engine and transmission are out, is it better to install the engine and transmission as a unit, or drop the engine in first and then the transmission". In that case I would always do them as a unit unless something (maneuvering room, availability of a leveler) prevents it. If only the engine or the transmission needs to be removed, then yeah, only remove that - no need to remove both just to service one. 

I would remove both to service one, I'm old and it's much less difficult than under the car

[87mj]

I ended up buying an inexpensive Harbor Freight lift.  I was able to get the engine out but the hydraulics in the lift were not strong enough to hold the load up for any period of time.  When I put it back in, I am going to use my tractor and loader in the driveway along with two sons to guide it in.

I read a previous post where using the two factory lift points was a bad idea.  Someone said they are not strong enough and would break.  From the pics, it looks like everyone is using those.  Has anyone had any problems?

BTW, the rope through the transmission tunnel is an excellent idea. 

Edited October 10, 2020 by 87mj

[Racer X]

1 hour ago, 87mj said:

I read a previous post where using the two factory lift points was a bad idea.  Someone said they are not strong enough and would break.  From the pics, it looks like everyone is using those.  Has anyone had any problems?

I have a set of the factory lifting brackets that I use for engine removal and installation. Used them dozens of times swinging engine and engine/transmission in and out of my Z cars. After use they go back int the tool box to be used the next time they are needed.

Never had a bit of trouble with them.

Edited October 10, 2020 by Racer X

[Patcon]

The intake studs could be an issue with the factory lift points. I have never had an issue. You could just wrap a chain around the manifold in the rear which would spread the load over more studs. The rear point does the lions share of the work

[CanTechZ]

3 hours ago, Racer X said:

I have a set of the factory lifting brackets that I use for engine removal and installation. Used them dozens of times swinging engine and engine/transmission in and out of my Z cars. After use they go back int the tool box to be used the next time they are needed.

Never had a bit of trouble with them.

Any chance you could post a sketch or pictures of your factory lifting brackets. I will be pulling my engine soon, transmission is already out.

Cheers, Mike

[Racer X]

4 minutes ago, CanTechZ said:

Any chance you could post a sketch or pictures of your factory lifting brackets. I will be pulling my engine soon, transmission is already out.

Cheers, Mike

I'll try to get some photos soon. I also promised @Captain Obvious photos of the underside of my 72, but have been working lots of overtime lately, and can't seem to budget time for that, so bear with me.

[Racer X]

OK, a quick and dirty cell phone pic.

The long one with 2 holes bolts on the right front side of the cylinder head just behind the fuel pump. The small one with one hole goes on the last exhaust manifold stud on the left rear of the head. My engine sling has tabs on the ends of the chains, and I use a 5/16” bolt, 2 fender washers, and a wing nut on each one to attach to the lifting fittings.