Carl Beck

I had Bob Smith in Golden, Co. as owning the car. He reported that it was originally white with a black interior, but had it painted Deep Red. At the time he reported the production date as 11/69. That would line up pretty well with the original engine serial number of L24-02746 as well. Carl B.

Hi Robin: That's an interesting picture. I'm guessing that your build date is actually 12/72 {not 12/02}, and I see that you have the toggle switch for the hazard warning flashers... rather than the Green Push/Pull lighted switch more common on the 73 Model Year cars. Makes me wonder at what point in time, Nissan started using the newer Green Push/Pull Switch. 1973Z and Bonzi Lon - which type of hazard switch do you have, and what is the build date on your 73's? FWIW, Carl B.

Hi bjhines: Either intentionally or unintentionally - you make it sound like all US spec. 73 240-Z's came with the relays and harnesses you describe/show. Just to be clear - they did not. When the 73 Model Year 240-Z's arrived - they carried basically the same wiring for the electric fuel pump as the 70-72 model years did. To mount an electric fuel pump at the tank, using the existing wiring in the harness - you simply added a jumper with an in-line fuse holder, to connect two wires under the right side of the dash. As Arne outlines... that makes the pump feed hot when the ignition key is on. Later in the Model Year - after thousands of customers were stranded by vapor lock and/or percolation problems - Nissan came up with a series of Dealer Installed modifications intended to address the starting and running problems, brought about by the 73 Emissions Standards here in the US. These modifications included "fix'es" and/or adjustments to many components, only one of which was the addition of an electric fuel pump. The harnesses and relays you show - were only part of a Dealer Installed Kit, called the V-3 Modifications Kit - only 73 240-Z's that were returned to the Dealers, along with continuing customer complaints, received the Kit. It is possible that very late production 73 Model Year 240-Z's started to arrive from the Factory with the electric fuel pump installed... maybe the last couple of months of production. I don't know for sure, as by then - I was no longer working for Datsun. All this is outlined in Nissan's Service Bulletin titled "DATSUN 240-Z & 260Z MODIFICATIONS PLUS - FUEL SYSTEM MODIFICATIONS, as well as in several other Service Bulletins. I'm certainly no expert on this - but the Service Procedure tells you to check the fuel pressure on the electric pump with the engine running at 1000 RPM. I don't understand how that could happen if the relay turns the pump off after starting. Vapor lock was only one of the issues, percolation and vacuum break were also major contributors to hard starting after running, stopping then restarting. FWIW, Carl B.

Steve/ Bonzi Lon Feed back from our Original Owners, that know they have the original dash in their cars - supports your position. I've updated, edited the description on "the Z Car Home Page" to make that distinction clear. http://zhome.com/Classic/Restore/dash.htm Thanks for pointing that out... Carl B.

"Restore" to put back in original condition, aka "as it left the factory" Give me the car - and you would have at least $35,000.00 in labor (and I'm cheap labor). That would be to take the car apart, send the shell out to a good bodyshop for body and paint. Send the engine out for a rebuild, tranny out for a rebuild etc. Then the labor to put the car back together to OEM spec.' and standards. In addition to the labor - you would need about $40,000.00 for parts and services like machine shops, electroplating, engine and tranny rebuild facilities, body shop etc. That would include the labor needed to find the parts in the first place. Take the car to any serious Restoration Shop - and you would have to give them a retainer for at least $50K before they would put the car in their shop. If on the other hand you are really thinking about "refreshing" a 240-Z that is in good condition to begin with - - you might get away with as little as $20K plus the cost of the car and necessary parts, perhaps another $15K.. The bottom line is - it would be financially silly to pay someone to restore a 240-Z for you - far less expensive to simply buy a restored car. You can still find #2 condition cars for $25K to $30K today. FWIW, Carl B.

Hi Jon: Visit the Club Store - hyper-link at the Left - and buy the CD-ROM for the S30. It includes the factory Parts Catalog for your Z. FWIW, Carl B.

Hi Robin: In your signature line - you list HLS30 140770 as your 73 240Z. That would be a correct VIN for a 73 Model Year 240-Z, even if it had a build date of 07/72 through 12/72 and beyond. If the date of manufacture on the data tag on the door jam says 02/72 then the VIN would be something less than HLS30 103xxx. Are we talking about two different cars? Or is it possible your build date is 07/73? Something is out of wack here. FWIW, Carl B.

1973Z: Maybe... send me a picture of your dash in that area.. and I'll ask some of our original owners to do the same. Give me the build date on your car and if Bonzi can do the same - we'll see what we come up with. thanks, Carl B.

Documented on the Z Car Home Page http://ZHome.com See: http://zhome.com/Classic/Restore/dash.htm

It looks much better in "race trim"... I noticed that when all this was in the future - the Automotive Press kept referring to the Skyline GT-R coming to America.... but also notice that Nissan itself refuses to use the name Skyline - and simply refers to the car as the Nissan GT-R. Anyone know why Nissan doesn't use the Skyline name on the GT-R? As an aside - I got to drive a friends new G37 with the 6spd. ... NICE, very nice ... FWIW, Carl B.

SOLD...for the BIN.... Carl B.

Hi Walter: I don't know for sure - but Bart's 240Z was sent to the Netherlands from Arizona. FWIW, Carl B.

Funds were wire transferred already for the 82 Turbo. True #1 Z's and ZX's will bring the money... That Turbo could easily be over $50K in a couple years. Carl B.

Dwell angle - reflects the number of degrees of distributor shaft rotation during which the points are closed, and the coil is energized. If the mechanical points have been replaced with either a magnetic or LED sensor it really doesn't change the need for the proper dwell angle to be present. You check the dwell angle with a digital meter. The dwell can be out of spec due to the distributor shaft/bearings being worn, sensors for the LED or magnet being improperly aligned etc. Although it is doubtful that it needed to be done on a ZX with 1400 miles... ;-) FWIW, Carl B.

What is the VIN on the car? Maybe that would yield some information... Carl B. Clearwater, FL USA http://ZHome.com

Here is one for a Collector. A 1982 280ZX Tubo, 5sd. with 1,415 miles. Starting Bid $22K and Buy-it-now for $29K. Anyone that has attempted to restore an older Z, knows that you could not duplicate this car without spending twice that amount today. E Bay Item Number: 300195233750 http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Datsun-Z-Series-1982-DATSUN-280ZX-TURBO-5-SPEED-1-410-MILES_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6187QQihZ020QQitemZ300195233750QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW FWIW, Carl B.

"strip" ?? Did you ship them the entire tail light assy - or did you remove the chrome trim and ship it only? Any problems removing and reinstalling the chrome strips? thanks, Carl

That is the rocker panel - it is two pieces - and inner and outter It is welded to the floorpan, as well as the front fire wall See Item #19, 20 and #2 #3.. You used to be able to get them from TABCO or Mill Supply FWIW, Carl B.

spoiler looks like the factory Nissan OEM part....

theianmonster would appear to be an up and coming "Burt". In my humble opinion, he and his post should be eliminated, rather than encouraged. It's the Moderators call, but I'd cut this off at the knees. As Hybridz was mentioned, I'll point out the fact that they would not for an instant, put up with anyone from the "purists" mind set, posting their trash talk on the Hybridz forum... and we should be just as vigilant about people trashing Classic Z Cars and then rubbing our collective noses in the resulting mess. FWIW, Carl B.

Hi Steve: I can assure you that starting with a car that was in relatively beautiful condition, you can spend close to $100,000.00 restoring an older competition car....Looking at the pictures of the work done just on the body of this Toyota - they spent closer to $1,000,000.00 or more by the time it was finished.... FWIW, Carl B.

I believe the salesman said that car sold for $128K. One could have bought it in 93 for about 28K. FWIW, Carl B.

Had a chance to go look at this 240Z today. Overall impression - looks like the previous owner found a pretty straight, solid 71 with about 75K miles. It was Yellow.. and the PO didn't like that much so... Color change to a dark green that is a few shades off the Datsun Dark Green of 1970/71. It is a shame that the Dealer "detailed" the undercarriage - spraying black paint all over everything certainly hurt the sale of the car. Nonetheless the floorboards and frame rails appear to be far better than average, but not perfect either. I'd guess that before the black undercoating there may have been some typical rust in the seams of the frame rails, perhaps a spot at the rear... but nothing that could not have been easily addressed without major metal work. The engine was amazing.... original matching numbers... it was one of the quietest engines at idle that I've heard in a long time. Took it out for a spin, pulled strong to 6500 RPM in 1, 2, 3.... no noise from the rear end. Drove straight... Shift lever typical monkey motion, needed new bushings. Clutch needs adjustment as it engaged right off the floor. No choke in the 4bl carb - but started right up, and after a few minutes of running, seems to smooth out and run fine. On the one hand it is a shame that this car wasn't treated to a stock "refresh" or even a restoration when it was in its original form ... on the other hand it will be a good weekend driver, or hobby car for someone at an affordable price. I'm sure the PO spent a ton of money making it "his"... even if it's not what most of us would have done. Noted in passing: Right rear bumper section - old, rust (but it looks like the center an left side are new) Half Dash cover Paint job and body work are acceptable for a driver.. Left headlight bucket is steel Original Hatch Lid... was amazingly rust free.. Floor boards were "blacked out" but looked pretty solid and unmolested. Carpet was not original, but it was a fairly high quality cut pile... and fit well All weatherstips/seals seem to be in very good condition... doors and hatch seem original Tail Light chrome was near perfect Threshold below the deck lid was in good shape - looks like the left side may have been worked on when the car was repainted.. but nothing bubbling up anywhere.. I'd guess the doglegs were replaced as well. What's it worth East of the Mississippi? It'll sell for between $10K and $14K... just depends on how long some potential buyer has been looking, and to whom a grand one way or the other won't matter much.. Serious buyers get tired of looking at junk after a time, then when a reasonable car comes along they will pay reasonable prices, usually far higher than they thought they would need too. This "Dealer" had about 50 Classic Cars there- many very nice indeed. They do not have an open showroom, cars are shown by appointment only to retail customers, mostly they hit the national auctions with the cars... Overall, while their write-up may have been a little flowery... it was for the most part accurate for Muscle Car guys trying to describe a Japanese Sports Car... one mechanic there seemed to have a pretty good grasp of the 240-Z's... FWIW, Carl B.

Hi Guys: I believe the seller is very confused as to who sets the market for these cars. He is also sadly confused as to exactly what market his Z would sell into. In broad terms: There is a Collector Market There is an Enthusiasts Market There is a Restorer's Market There is a Parts Market It is true that a car is original only once. What this seller seems to miss is the fact that his car having been used for 39K miles - is no longer "original" in the eyes of the Collector. It's a used car to them and as everyone has pointed out - it has lots and lots of flaws that no Collector would accept. True Collectors will pay the highest prices, but only for real #1 or #2 condition cars. These 240-Z's are selling for between $20K at the bargain end and $35K at the top end. The car we are discussing is at best a #3 condition car as it sits now. It is true that a car is original only once. What the seller fails to understand, is that real enthusiasts would love this car for being so well cared for, so stock, so unmolested etc., but they also know that lots of cars like this can still be found in the $12K to $14K range. They know the values of the cars in the Enthusiast's Market... and sometimes they will pay a few grand over the current market to get a car they really love... The seller is silly to expect Enthusiasts to pay more..... Look at Arne's Z with 65K miles for something less than $6K (was it?).. vs the current offering with 40K miles at $20K.... just isn't that much difference. It is true that a car is original only once. Restorers want as original as possible, but they aren't willing to pay anywhere near as much as the Enthusiasts, because the overall condition of the cars they buy are far below the cars the Enthusiasts buy. A restorer is going to strip the car to a bare body shell and start over - so faded paint won't matter, the car doesn't have to be in top road worthy condition, scratches, minor dings and cosmetic flaws won't matter - because everything is going to be refreshed or restored anyway. The car under discussion is way to nice and way to expensive to appeal to the restorers. The 71 here in St. Petersburg with less than 40K original miles and really all stock and original - is the perfect car for a serious restorer - even at $6K. When we are talking about an "original" car being worth more than a correctly restored car - keep in mind that the 240-Z under discussion, as well as all of them like it - are really no longer "original".. time and use have destroyed their originality. When you look under the hood of this car, do you see bright shinny Cad Plated parts.. as original? Or do you see parts that the Cad plating has sacrificed itself protecting, and are now dull silver with some corrosion? Do you see all the braided hoses looking like new - or most of the original braided hoses present but looking a little worse for wear? Sorry but the car under discussion is no where close to "original" in the eyes of any Collector.. its just another low mileage used car. In the eyes of the Enthusiasts, it's a great example of a mostly original 240-Z, but the Enthusiasts definition of "original" carries a far different meaning than that of the Collector. The seller had it sold for $20K - and if it had been exactly as originally described it would most likely have sold - - but it wasn't. Note the seller even admits that he had to detail it, even the undercarriage before offering it again on the market... FWIW, Carl B.

Hi Bart: HLS30 163693 would have had a Date of Manufacture of 06/73. So it would have been a 1973 Model Year 240Z. It would most likely have had an original engine serial number in the range of L24-175xxx to L24-182xxx So it would have been originally equipped with: - the Flat Top emissions carb.'s - 2.5 mph bumpers - steel head light nacelles - 3 speed intermittent windshield wipers - lighted heater/vent controls in addition to the standard equipment found on the 72 Model Year 240-Z's.