HS30-H

Actually, that isn't strictly true. The FOS organisers announced that the GT-R would be attending ( it was even on the FOS pre-event website for a while ) and there was a lot of gossip that it was going to be there anyway. My personal impression was that probably only around 5% of the showgoers spotted the GT-R and even fewer cared about it. The rest either didn't notice it, or didn't care anyway. There's always too much interesting stuff going on at the FOS for a single proto ( in disguise, and being purposely elusive ) to stop the show. I got the distinct impression myself that it lacked 'presence'. Some of those gaffes caused a few guffaws in the group I was in. I think the organisers need a new editor...... Alan T.

More pics:

Tony, This young lady ( see pic ) says she can help you. :classic: Clue: Take a close look at that front 'number' plate, and the emblem on the right hand side of the nose. One of Nissan's long lost aborted models.......... More pics to follow. Alan T.

Carl, I did think of Ron when I made that last post. It figures that the story is at least partly apocryphal ( to be expected really ), but I sometimes wonder just how many kits Datsun Competition USA actually sold, and where they have all gone (?). They don't seem to pop up all that often, do they? Maybe time has been harsh on their numbers.......... It's a real shame, because they are really nicely made parts. Nothing to do with oil cooling as far as I'm aware. The factory race cars certainly didn't use them ( they had comprehensive ducting and sealed sections inside the 'mouth' of the nose ) and they would not have been needed to be fitted to the road cars to aid in any homologation issues ( ducting was 'free' on the Japanese race cars ). I've got a Japanese technical bulletin section from one of the Nissan 'Service Shuho' booklets that details the duct update in connection with aircon function. I'll see if I can find it and scan it. Alan T.

Carl, The additional ducts ( which simply bolted onto the original ZG lower panel ) were not on the early production ZG models ( my car never had them, for example ) and were added to the later production models in an attempt to help cure poor performance of the aircon, and other heat-related issues that were showing up as fuel percolation etc. I am told that some early production ZGs had these ducts retro-fitted by Nissan mechanics when they went in for routine servicing. Later factory-supplied spare parts did have the ducts on them: see attached pic of my NOS spare lower panel - which probably dates from around 1974/75 I would guess. This is an usued factory item, still with the part number sticker on it. I was told in Japan that only the very first deliveries of G-nose kits sent to Datsun Competition in the USA were the 'real thing', and that Datsun Competition USA soon made their own ( locally produced ) versions that were a simplified ( and therefore cheaper ) version of the OEM Japanese parts. I can't vouch for the accuracy of that story though. Alan T.

As far as the FIA are concerned, it is the final version of the amendment ( ie 9/8V ) that carries most weight, as it is the one that is on the most up-to-date version of homologation no. 3023. As far as Tony's problem is concerned, 9/8V should help him the most I think.

The full results of the HybridZ wind tunnel tests have not actually been made public as yet. I believe they are going to be published in an upcoming magazine article, and after that we will be free to discuss them in detail on this and other forums. I suggest we await the publication of the full results before discussing this any further, and respect the wishes of the team that carried out the tests. Alan T.

Carl, They didn't test a proper factory-type G-Nose, did they? Do you honestly believe that Nissan ( and everybody else ) would have used the parts on their Group 4 cars if they were detrimental to aero performance over the 'standard' S30-series Z front end treatment? Alan T.

Yes, I'll scan the pages from the appropriate year's FIA year book and send them direct to you via e-mail. Got some other stuff to back it up with too. I suggest taking most of this discussion offline from here on in. Let's not allow your 'enemy' to get a look through any hole in the fence......... What's that old racing proverb? Something like ".....The REAL racing starts when the rule book is printed." :classic: Alan T.

The Kanji script on the first one reads 'Kyoku To'. That was the original Japanese name ( and one of the trademarks ) of a long-established and well respected company called 'Far East Trading' ( F.E.T. for short ). This is a nice manifold, very close to the original Nissan 'Sports Option' equipment, and with a generic 8mm spindle that is easy to find linkage parts for. However, as jmortensen has pointed out, it is more likely to have been supplied to fit an L20A or L20E six, and therefore will have a lot of meat at the cylinder head joint that would need to be taken out. Carburettor flange end for the 40mm and 44mm carbs ( 45mm Webers and Dell'Ortos too ) is the same though. The second one looks very similar to the 'Sanyo Kiki' / 'S.K' / 'Sanyo Sports Kit' item, although the pic is not that clear and I don't see the telltale 'San Yo' logo on the centre casting. These too were well respected in their time, and the linkage works well enough when set up properly. Again, probably originally made to fit the L20A or L20E sixes - so plenty of meat on the cylinder head end. Neither of them are particularly 'rare' in Japan, but these two eBay auctions are ( currently at least ) at comparatively low prices, and in my opinion they are good value. Alan T.

Tony, I have no idea where this guy came up with the figure of '482' either. I suspect that he might be confusing the 'HS30-H' model 'Fairlady 240ZG' with the 'PS30' and 'PS30-SB' model 'Fairlady Z432' and 'Fairlady Z432-R'. Even then his figures would be based on disputed evidence......... If I were you, I would stake all my chips on the FIA homologation amendment that legalised the factory G-nose for Group 4 competition use. The mere existence of this amendment page proves ( as far as the FIA were concerned ) that over 500 identical cars had been series-produced and were meant for sale to the general public. He can't argue with that. Amendment 9/8V to FIA homologation number 3023 proves that Nissan had complied with Article 251, Category A, Group 4 ( Special Touring Cars section ) of the International Sporting Code, Appendix "J", and had produced the quantity of 500 cars necessary within the time allowed. In the case of Group 4 during the period concerned, this was 24 consecutive months or less. The guys who protested you, and your sanctioning body, can't argue with this if they recognise and adhere to FIA rules. The amendment 9/8V was valid from 1st October 1973, and was retrospectively applied from a start date of August 1972. Factory 'HS30-H' 'Fairlady 240ZG' models were sold to the general public in Japan from late October 1971 through to the end of 1973. I don't believe I have ever seen an official factory-related document that conclusively states the quantities of Fairlady 240ZG models sold - but I have been told by numerous sources over the years ( and many of them ex-Nissan employees ) that just over 1000 were made. This would have made the G-Nose parts eligible for Group 2 ( over 1000 made ) but the factory never bothered with the necessary amendment to the homologation as it would have been pointless. I have in the past been called upon to 'prove' certain things to my insurance company here in the UK with regard to my factory Fairlady 240ZG. I carried out a lot of background research into the model, and had to present it to them as part of an 'agreed value' policy. The car is the only known genuine factory-built 'HS30-H' model in Europe - so it can be troublesome to insure properly. I've made sworn affidavits for presentation to RAC MSA and FIA competition scrutineers in the past, and would be happy to prepare one for you if you think it would help your situation. I can provide copies of all the necessary FIA regulation paragraphs and factory-sourced photos and data to support it. But to be honest, that single page ( amendment 9/8V to homologation number 3023 ) is all you should need. The ZG parts were available from the 'Sports Option' lists in Japan right up until Nissan's competitions departments ( 'Nissan Sports' / 'Nissan Sport Service' et al ) were merged to form NISMO in 1982. From then on, the parts continued to be available from NISMO until at least the mid-Nineties. They were NOT offered as a true 'Factory Option' to be specified on a new car - but one of the authorised 'Nissan Sport Service' dealers in Japan ( there were 17 of these by mid 1973 ) could supply and fit the parts should the Japanese customer wish. This would however have had implications for him on taxation class and other bureacracy that was open to interpretation ( especially by troublesome traffic police officers, apparently! ) so I don't think this will be all that useful to you in your current situation. Let me know what you need. Cheers, Alan T.

But that would be forgetting the Fairlady 240Z ( 'HS30' ), Fairlady 240Z-L ( 'HS30-S' ) or Fairlady 240ZG ( 'HS30-H' ) models. I think the thread title would probably be better if it were "Pic request, JDM S30-series Zs" It isn't a Fairlady, and it isn't an HS30-H either. Look again. That's an LHD car. You do irony now too, then? Diseazd, Take a look at this site's own Gallery section for LOTS of pics of Japanese home market S30-series Z cars ( of all denominations ). In particular, try a search for 'Sagamiko' in the 'Events' section. Here's a link to some: http://www.classiczcars.com/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=551 Alan T.

Well said that man. Not many others appear to be listening though........ The only purpose this thread is currently serving is that of identifying the people who are pissing in the well that we all need to drink from. I have no idea how member 'Mckrack' managed to avoid the site radar for so long and make upwards of 150 posts, but the alarms should be ringing by now and surely he's just a nasty accident waiting to happen. Those who are being sucked-in to this spurious thread please take note. I advocate a lifetime ban from this forum before its reputation is any more damaged. Alan T.

As a matter of fact, Matsuo san sketched that front end side-view during a conversation I initiated with him regarding the ZG. His notation of 'L' on the sketch meaning 'Long' nose Z. We were discussing headlamp covers and ther details of the front ends. He was - and is - very proud of the styling of the ZG. 'Kotobuki' also made the FRP parts for the factory ZG, by the way.......... Just out of interest, I believe we first discussed Kotobuki and the headlamp bucket manufacturing on this thread, back in 2004: http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15711 Alan T.

Yes. Me too. "Years later"? Are we playing S30-series Z Chief Designer Top Trumps here? I think I first met Matsuo san seven years ago - at one of the NISMO Festivals at Fuji Speedway - and then again at one of the Club S30 / S30 Owners Club meets at Sagamiko, where he did a mini talk-through of some design points on the S30-series Z ( using Takeuchi san's 432-R as his guinea pig ) which was fascinating. When he visited the UK on his way to Frankfurt, I was able to spend quite a bit longer with him - giving me the chance to ask him some questions that were of particular interest to me. Of course I'm not an architect, so I could have misunderstood some of what he was saying.........

So whereabouts in the "Project X Challengers" book is the story of the headlight buckets being changed from FRP to steel solely to satisfy US MVSS laws for the "1973 Model Year"? I only have the ( original ) Japanese edition - which does not mention US MVSS in relation to the headlamp buckets. Yokoyama wrote a nicely softened-up and simplified ( 'Katayama' version ) of events, but I still don't see anything but purely practical reasons for the ( temporary ) use of FRP for the headlamp buckets until the press tooling and jigs for the two-part steel versions could be perfected.

Well, I have had the great privilege of spending some time ( a few times, actually ) with Mr Yoshihiko Matsuo. He has a great number of such stories to tell. I think it was Hiroo Miyate who had the brainwave on the station platform. Miyate was one of Matsuo's colleagues on the S30-series Z design team, and his input - along with the other key members - was very important. The story has been recounted several times in magazine articles over the last few years - probably because it makes a nice little vignette, and the 'brainwave on the platform' illustrates that this ( young! ) design team had put their hearts and souls into the design, and were totally immersed in what they were doing. They hardly ever switched off. There's a very interesting interview with Matsuo san in the June 2007 edition ( Volume 121 ) of Nostalgic Hero magazine, where he recounts some more interesting tales surrounding the design of the S30-series Z. Some of the photos used to illustrate the article are from Matsuo's own personal archive. Fascinating stuff. Alan T.

That's more than somewhat 'cart before horse'......... Chief Designer Matsuo relates the story rather differently. As 26th-Z alluded to in his post, Nissan Shatai struggled to make the headlamp buckets from steel initially ( due to their complex shape ) and one of the design team had the brainwave to get them made from FRP. This brainwave came whilst sitting on a railway station platform, on seats that had been moulded from FRP by a company called 'Kotobuki'. Kotobuki made the headlamp buckets from FRP for Nissan, but in the meantime ( during 1970 ) Nissan Shatai's press tool designers managed to devise an economical and practical way to make them from steel. This allowed them to drop Kotobuki as the supplier, who had proved to be fairly slow and expensive - which was understandable considering the process involved. The intention always was to make them from steel. It just took a little time to sort it out, that's all. Alan T.

Winning bid was 4,000,000 Yen. Genuine KPGC10 I believe. The only 'problem' being that the car had lost its registration number through years of storage and the previous owner not being present ( either deceased or otherwise incapacitated ) - so a possible lack of paperwork. A little bit of bureaucracy to deal with, but not impossible. Hopefully another one saved then....... :-)

zbane, Almost exactly two years ago we had a thread started on the subject of that book ( a classiczcars.com classic thread with many valid points and contrasting viewpoints, in my opinion ) and it still makes good reading, I reckon: http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19471 Alan T.

You know, somehow I find that strangely comforting. ;-) You may well have read me right. But my condescension is possibly a little more tongue-in-cheek than you might imagine, and Carl gives just as good as he gets anyway. It's a two-way street. You're going to have your work cut out if you are volunteering to be referee in that particular contest :-) Aha! Noted - and with a red face. I'll leave my foot in my mouth a little longer as a kind of penance. Sorry. Well, the abridged version ( possibly better suited to your attention span? ) is that - in the world of the first generation Z car at least - I'm nobody. That's something that both you and I have in common. Next question? Nice to converse with a man who knows professionalism when he sees it. On the other hand I find it slightly disappointing that you don't seem to be able to imitate it ( [D*ck van Dyke fake 'Cockney' accent] mate [/D*ck van Dyke fake 'Cockney' accent] ). You have a half-hidden talent for comedy. Don't hide your light under a bushel. You can use the 'SEARCH' function on the forum to find out that your opinion is ill-informed. You're making a great Bud Costello to my Lou Abbott. Here's the punch line: For the 1969 calendar year, Nissan Shatai ( that's the factory that actually made 'our' cars ) reported in writing that they had made a total of 1,512 'S30-series' Z cars. Of that 1,512 Z cars, 543 were categorised as 'Export' models. Note that this does not mean that all 543 of these 'Export' models were 'HLS30' VIN-prefixed cars, nor that they were all actually sent to the USA and Canada. Of that 1,512 Z cars, 969 were categorised as 'Domestic' models. 'Domestic' ( just a little reminder for you ) in this case being Japan. A few of those 969 cars, and some of their brothers and sisters that were born slightly later, are now some of the most monetarily valuable and 'collectable' Z cars in the world today. You must be kidding. This is a life and death struggle we are dealing with here.......... Alan T.

I noticed that you used the term "we" when you yourself had not actually posted on the thread ( unless I missed that? ). There's part of my point right there; This is not a conversation between a bunch of acquaintances being conducted across a bar-room table. This is the internet, and the thread will become part of a resource that can be referenced by anyone with 'net access for some years to come. Hence the need ( I think ) to make it more clear as to what we are talking about. Especially as the topic in question is based around the subject of Japanese cars, rather than American cars. The cars in question are 'for sale' on eBay. That means that anyone with an eBay account ( anywhere in the World ) is able to bid on them, or ask somebody to bid for them on their behalf. It would not take much effort to get in touch with the seller direct either - so anything is possible. I myself could - arguably - make anoffer on them ( taking advantage of the low relative value of the $US against British Sterling ) and end up with a feasibly restorable low-VIN 'HLS30' model for not much more than I would have to stump up for a fairly bad condition UK market car. There's a different perspective of relative value for you. You see my point? Once cars get to a certain level of perceived relative value, then the powers of the WORLD market come into play - in just the same way that they do in the markets for art, antiques and other portable items. International borders and shipping / duty costs start to be less of a hindrance and disincentive, and items will move around more. This will affect prices, and anybody who thinks that they are still looking at a local garage-sale situation is going to get the occasional surprise. I think we should all remember the true implication of terms like "1969 production Z cars" and "the Collector Z Car Community" when we use them on international internet-based forums. To do so is to be wise, and I think that has got to be a good thing. Alan T.

And who exactly might "we" be? I suggest you take a closer look at post #23, and think about it's contents from the viewpoint of a person who might well reside outside the borders of the United States of America. This is an internet forum with members ( and viewers ) from all over the world. If anyone wants to talk in 'definitive' terms about the values of 'Z cars produced in 1969', and "the Collector Z Car Community" ( whatever that is ) then they really ought to make it clear that they are only talking about the 'HLS30U' model and the territory of the United States of America.

Sulio, I don't think SK ( Sanyo Kiki ) have made any L6 inlet manifolds for many years now - unless you know different? Bear in mind that some of the inlet manifolds on the market were originally aimed at LHD configurations, and are therefore different in shape to those aimed at RHD configurations. Some of the LHD-biased designs were aimed at avoiding interference with tubular exhaust manifolds that were themselves avoiding the steering linkages on LHD cars. The Nissan L6 was fitted to so many different cars over such a long period of time that it makes used inlet manifold buying a bit of a minefield if you include those produced for the Japanese market. Companies such as SK, Hayashi, HKS, Mikuni and many other used to produce different inlet manifolds and linkage kits to suit different generations of Z, let alone Skylines, Laurels and other models of Nissans with L-gata engines. Personally, I think the manifold and linkage kits still produced by Harada and Tomei would be best for your RHD car. The Harada in particular has a nice linkage kit included in it which can be set up using the original rod actuation or a cable actuation ( with the parts supplied ). I have a Harada on my ZG, and have sourced and imported them for numerous users here in the UK and Europe - all without complaint. I would have thought there would be plenty of importers in Australia who would source a Harada or Tomei manifold from Japan for you? Worth asking, anyway. Alan T.

I know how you feel. Almost every time I see you writing about these Japanese cars. Only up until the point that you started waxing lyrical about 1969 production year Z cars, and writing about ".....the 69 Z owners..." and "...the Collector Z Car Community...." without qualifying the fact that you were only referring to one market model and one market. After that the thread was fair game for a little reminder that these are Japanese cars we are talking about here. As is so often the case, you are making my point for me ( thank you! ). You cannot have your cake and eat it, can you? You can't harp on about rarity and market value for one sector of the first generation Z car family whilst ignoring another sector - equally valid in the design and engineering story - that was, and still is, much rarer and which commands higher resale and insurance values today. Some of us here are very proud and happy to own some of the "few", and have had the pleasure of the Chief Designer of the 'family' telling us that they were, and are, just as important in the concept, design and engineering processes as the "many". No, I don't need to do anything other than remind you that the first generation S30-series Z cars were a family of models ( designed, engineered and productionised as such ) and were aimed at more than one single market. That's straight from the mouth of the Chief Designer, and backed up by his team. If you are writing about only one market version ( and even then forgetting that the 'HLS30' models were sold in territories other than mainland USA ) then you need to qualify that fact. It's not difficult. Just a matter of a few extra words. And like me, you don't seem to be short of words and the time to write them. Alan T.