Jump to content
red67

Trouble Downshifting to First Gear?

Recommended Posts

OMG, Thank you! What a great place! @Zed Head yes, PO told me, the owner of the shop that worked on his Z, called him one day, and said I just acquired a rebuilt 5speed that would be perfect for your car. Do you want it, and he said, hell yes!

I have the original 4speed trans too. 

@siteunseen Thank you, That's one of them, but didn't @EuroDat post call for two washers?

Edited by red67

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, red67 said:

OMG, Thank you! What a great place! @Zed Head yes, PO told me, the owner of the shop that worked on his Z, called him one day, and said I just acquired a rebuilt 5speed that would be perfect for your car. Do you want it, and he said, hell yes!

I have the original 4speed trans too. 

@siteunseen Thank you, That's one of them, but didn't @EuroDat post call for two washers?

Yes there's two, the one in my pics and an o-ring.

Speedo pinion seal 32709-14600

Speedo pinion o-ring 32710-14600

image.png

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Got it! Thank You!!!   When I remove the cable, will trans fluid come out?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, red67 said:

Got it! Thank You!!!   When I remove the cable, will trans fluid come out?

Nope. That cog is the same height as the fill plug so it shouldn't unless it's overfilled.

When you get it fixed you can do what most of us have done. Drive it and when you park for the night put a newspaper under there then check it the next morning.

Good luck.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, red67 said:

Got it! Thank You!!!   When I remove the cable, will trans fluid come out?

Nope. That cog is the same height as the fill plug so it shouldn't unless it's overfilled.

When you get it fixed you can do what most of us have done. Drive it and when you park for the night put a newspaper under there then check it the next morning.

Good luck.

image.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, siteunseen said:

Nope. That cog is the same height as the fill plug so it shouldn't unless it's overfilled.

The fluid expands a lot though when it's warm.  So, do it when the engine and transmission are cool.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, siteunseen said:

Yes there's two, the one in my pics and an o-ring.

Speedo pinion seal 32709-14600

Speedo pinion o-ring 32710-14600

image.png

Mmm That photo looks familiar😁

Like site already mention. There is a o-ring seal on the outside of the adator and a lip seal inside for the pinion.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, EuroDat said:

Mmm That photo looks familiar😁

Like site already mention. There is a o-ring seal on the outside of the adator and a lip seal inside for the pinion.

Well yeah! I snipped it from your thread in 2013. You are the man Chas! So helpful to everyone. 

And to the OP there's what I call a top hat seal in there too. Be very careful those are nla. Use good thick teflon tape on everything and you'll be good to go.

Edited by siteunseen
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 10/2/2020 at 4:45 PM, Pilgrim said:

 

Incidentally, when I looked up the gear oil for my '83 ZXT on the Amsoil site, it shows an ATF synthetic for the '83 5-speed. I'm pretty sure that is wrong!

Chrysler used ATF in manual transmissions from the mid 1980’s up to when they stopped offering manual gearboxes. It works just fine, and helped raise fuel economy numbers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Racer X said:

Chrysler used ATF in manual transmissions from the mid 1980’s up to when they stopped offering manual gearboxes. It works just fine, and helped raise fuel economy numbers.

True, but I'm not sure it's relevant.  Mercedes used ATF in their 4-speed manual transmission in the 1959 219 sedan my dad owned, but I wouldn't use it in the 3-speed with OD transmission that was in my 1959 Ford.

The last time I checked (before this) the correct lube for the factory 5-speed in my 1983 280ZX Turbo was a synthetic GL-4 75-90 gear oil. That's what I'm using and and I don't plan to change it.

Edited by Pilgrim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The ZXT 5 speed was made by Borg Warner.  There is a bunch of discussion about the ATF spec around the interwebs.  The ATF spec is correct, from what I've gathered.  Some people suggest that the needle bearings might not get proper lubrication using the thicker fluid.

I have a Ford 5 speed with Ford ATF, Mercon V, as the spec'ed fluid.  It had shifting problems though so I switched to Pennzoil Synchromesh.  Lower viscosity than 75W-90 but higher than ATF.   It's been great and fixed the problem but the Ford guys say I'm going to ruin it if I don't use Ford product in it (that's what all Ford guys say though).  That was 30,000 miles ago.

Use this in the Google and there's a bunch - "borg warner t5 transmission fluid type".

image.png

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Never seen that chart before! "Or type Dexron" is an interesting addition. My tyranny has lasted 130k miles with the original and later synthetic gear oil, so I'm not motivated to change.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It does say "or", for sure.  The history of Dexron doesn't offer any clarity either.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DEXRON

I will probably just use Synchromesh synthetic fluid in any manual transmission I have in the future.  Seems like some genius fluids engineer created the ultimate fluid and it works for everything.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, Pilgrim said:

Never seen that chart before! "Or type Dexron" is an interesting addition. My tyranny has lasted 130k miles with the original and later synthetic gear oil, so I'm not motivated to change.

Do you use Red Line? That's what I like. Nobody stocks it here so I get it from amazon.com about $15 a quart? 

Wait one second! My transmission is mt-90 red line.

Screenshot_20201009-153615_Samsung Internet.jpg

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I once experimented with a 5 speed gearbox that would'nt go from 4 to 2th gear without a lot of noise..  i put in SLICK50  does someone here know that stuff?  The gearbox is now after ~30000km again a problem shifting from 4 to 2th or even to 3th.. 

I ask myself, how can i get the oil AND!  the SLICK50! out of there to test an other oil. (before taking it apart and get new sinchro's in?  It's a FS5C71B so a very rare gearbox with rare sinchromeshes..)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Paint thinner? That's what motorman7 uses to degrease old parts

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah.. paint thinner i could try.. maybe fill the gearbox with diesel might work to..?

I wanted to ad.. if i go from 4 to 2th realy slowly it works without the horrible noise..  i can feel and hear the turning of the gears and hear them stop..(i push the lever against 2th gear but don't go into 2th) then i can shift into 2th without noise.

But i think a new set of sinchromeshes would be the best solution.. but where do i find those for a FS5C71B?  (euro 5 speed 240z box)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are you double - clutching your downshifts? I sure would be. It greatly reduces the work of the sync rings. I do it now by reflex on my ZX.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 10/10/2020 at 3:42 AM, dutchzcarguy said:

i put in SLICK50  does someone here know that stuff? 

I remember Slick50.  Based on how synchro gears work, that seems like a not-good choice for transmission fluid (no offense).  It has PTFE particles in it to minimize friction.  Synchros need a balance between friction and viscosity to allow the speed matching to occur.

If you want to take a chance with $50 I'd try the AC Delco Friction-modified Synchromesh before tearing the transmission down.  I'd just let the other stuff drain out and refill with Synchromesh.

Otherwise, there's a post on Hybridz about modifying Porsche synchros to work in the steel synchro 5 speeds.  I think that FS5C has steel instead of "brass" (yellow).

https://slick50.info/manual-gearbox-treatment/

http://skepdic.com/slick50.html

https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/press-releases/1996/07/quaker-state-ads-slick-50-are-false-and-misleading-ftc-charges

https://forums.hybridz.org/topic/92246-to-people-with-experience-with-the-datsun-comp-5-speed-need-parts-for-one/

Edited by Zed Head
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I tried to buy the AC delco/GM Friction-modified oil here locally (Europe), but couldn't find it anywhere. There was a company in Italy, but he didn't stock it anymore.

I ended up ordering it from the states, but they cancelled and refunded the money because it was considered dangerous goods being flamable. Thats is going back 5 years ago, but I doubt much has changed.

Edited by EuroDat
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, EuroDat said:

I tried to buy the AC delco/GM Friction-modified oil here locally (Europe), but couldn't find it anywhere. There was a company in Italy, but he didn't stock it anymore.

I ended up ordering it from the states, but they cancelled and refunded the money because it was considered dangerous goods being flamable. Thats is going back 5 years ago, but I doubt much has changed.

Is it possible to get a state side member to ship it to you?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pennzoil's brand seems to work just as well.  Internet has it that Pennzoil developed the formula for GM (AC Delco).

I wonder how Dutchzcar managed to find Slick50 in The Netherlands.

Just remembered though that the other magic fluid for Porsche synchros is Swepco 201.  Diluted with ATF for the Nissan units.  But it came from Porsche world, a guy who owned a Porsche shop.  JMortensen has posted about it.  Maybe Swepco 201 can be found, it's more of an industrial fluid.

https://www.swepcolube.com/products/swepco-201-multi-purpose-gear-lube

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Back to my leaky speedo, can I change the seals under the car, or does the cable have to come out?  Thank you!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, red67 said:

Back to my leaky speedo, can I change the seals under the car, or does the cable have to come out?  Thank you!

You don't need to remoce the cable. Just disconnect it by unscrewing it from the adapter and then remove the adapter. The seals are in the adaptoer.

Screenshot_20201012-063919.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use. We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.