Cindy McCain, First Lady of Drift

[Carl Beck]

Easily brought down to $0.75 a gallon? You're smoking crack.

Ok - make it $1.25 if you like. Heck make it $1.50...

I don't think it advances a logical discussion of the main subject (our overall energy policy, supply/demand, alternatives to consider etc) to allow ourselves to get side tracked debating the project price per gallon.

The real question is - Is it feasible to regain control of our own government, and once again make it responsive to the needs/desires of its citizens, rather than being driven by greed, money and power. (aka... freeing the capitalists to pillage the Global Market as they see fit)

I think the secondary question is - what can we actually expect to do, in a reasonably short (3-5 years) period of time to keep ourselves and our economy above water, as it related to the US's energy needs.

There are so many serious issues and problems facing every alternative source of energy - that we the people really need far more complete information than we are getting. I seriously doubt that we will get it from the current batch of politicians, nor the current media.

FWIW,

Carl

[doradox]

Ok - make it $1.25 if you like. Heck make it $1.50...

I don't think it advances a logical discussion of the main subject (our overall energy policy, supply/demand, alternatives to consider etc) to allow ourselves to get side tracked debating the project price per gallon.

The real question is - Is it feasible to regain control of our own government, and once again make it responsive to the needs/desires of its citizens, rather than being driven by greed, money and power. (aka... freeing the capitalists to pillage the Global Market as they see fit)

I think the secondary question is - what can we actually expect to do, in a reasonably short (3-5 years) period of time to keep ourselves and our economy above water, as it related to the US's energy needs.

There are so many serious issues and problems facing every alternative source of energy - that we the people really need far more complete information than we are getting. I seriously doubt that we will get it from the current batch of politicians, nor the current media.

FWIW,

Carl

I'd have to agree with you there. And sorry about the crack comment.

Steve

[JimmyZ]

The real question is - Is it feasible to regain control of our own government, and once again make it responsive to the needs/desires of its citizens, rather than being driven by greed, money and power. (aka... freeing the capitalists to pillage the Global Market as they see fit)

Carl

Sadly Carl, I think we all know the answer is no. We will never get control of our society from the govt or the central banking system. Perhaps when we have the next crash (1929 type) we will have a slim chance of hitting the reset button.

Wars are fought for resources or economics. Although I'm a Republican I can see the transparancy of Iraq. We need their resources.

There's no point in debating if the left or right is correct. We just need someone in there to do what's right. With the Freddie/Fannie bailout (and others) we are well on our way to making the dollar worthless. The greed inspired by the fiat economy knows no end in an unenlightened society. It is designed to fail.

2c

Check this out http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9050474362583451279 Money as debt! A biased but basically true video our monetary system and it's ills.

Jim

RE Cindy McCain... I didn't like her that much before but now that I foind out she can drive I've found an appreciation for Mr McCain's wifey. Very cool.

Edited September 14, 2008 by JimmyZ

[gnosez]

I thought it was ironic that the T. Bone Pickins energy plan is being listed on the side of this thread.

Old T. Bone told Congress and anyone that would listen that, "hell ya, I made my first 80 billion off of oil sales but that we (America) couldn't drill their way out of this problem.

As to oil reserves in the US (not total energy reserves of oil, gas, and coal) we have about 2% of the world's supply (that's less that 5 years if all we use is US based oil supplies).

Please don't mention Katrina and forget to mention a Bush gutted FEMA's failure to do it's job.

Don't use the government is the problem crap after you gut it and put in people who are qualified or have any ethics (like those nice folks over in the Interior Dept who really were in bed with Big Oil). "See big government doesn't work".

And where is the surplus we had 8 years ago? Why does China own so much of our bonds? And yes the current war is a drain but it could have been paid for without much of an impact on each and every one of us. Not now.

Entitlements? Let's take about hand-backs. A State sends the Federal government money and gets back funds for highway improvement, education grants, sewer upgrades, etc.

Now let's talk about all those States that yell loudest for "State's Rights" and "less government". Funny thing is they are the ones who for every dollar they put into the Federal treasury, they get $1.25 back. Most "liberal" (aka blue States) get back less than a $1.00 for every dollar they put in.

Ms Palin gets my money ( I happen to live in a "blue" state) and then says we need to cut back on Federal hand-outs. Okay. Let's start with a dollar in and a dollar out rule. Alaska with all it's oil and gas money still gets more Federal money than it puts in to the treasury. So does Texas, and most of the other "red" states. Funny how that happens.

But push come to shove, vote. But do so AFTER you have actually thought about the issues (war, the economy, our rights as citizens, the environment, health care, etc.).

And as someone who does volunteer work at the local VA hospital, community organizers are real people who get down in the trenches to help people and are not people who should be sneered at by folks with no dirt on their hands.

[mikewags]

Maybe I would find these stories of rich celebrities learning karate, horseback riding, or whatever - more enlightening if they actually worked hard at it.

Well, if you watched the video; her and her son Jake went to Japan to learn how to drift from the "master-of-drifting". (I bet that was cheap! ) When you have as much money as her, anything is possible - and easier to the extent of who you can pay to teach you.

For instance: I want to learn Jeen Kune Do (Bruce Lee's martial arts style) - of course I can pick up a book and learn it, or I can go and pay Jerry Poteet (Jeet Kune Do Master) to learn. I wonder which would be easier and more effective...Oh wait, I don't have the money to afford him.

Edited September 15, 2008 by mikewags

[geezer]

I'd have to agree with you there. And sorry about the crack comment.

Steve

Please, take it easy on Carl...he gets his crack delivered in the form of Series 1 dashes!ROFLROFL

[JimmyZ]

Maybe I would find these stories of rich celebrities learning karate, horseback riding, or whatever - more enlightening if they actually worked hard at it.

Why are people so critical of the rich? If you remember the last election the Dems had Kerry's wife. ($$$) Money and high level candidates go hand in hand. I don't think you'll find a person who has made it to nomination is poor. (Or on our tier)

The thing that pisses me off the most is what each party has to do to achieve/maintain power. This is usually at our expense.

[doradox]

I thought it was ironic that the T. Bone Pickins energy plan is being listed on the side of this thread.

As to oil reserves in the US (not total energy reserves of oil, gas, and coal) we have about 2% of the world's supply (that's less that 5 years if all we use is US based oil supplies).

FYI, reserves are only wells that have already been drilled. ANWR, OCS, Shale oil do not count as they are not currently tapped. There's more than a little oil out there especially at $100+ a barrel.

Steve

[gnosez]

No, the 2% is total expected oil which INCLUDES both tapped and un-tapped deposits based on assumptions done by both the oil companies and the US gov't. It includes shale, deep and shallow, interior and off shore locations.

Carl is spot on re: oil markets. Alaska's oil doesn't come down to the lower 48 (it's pretty dirty stuff and instead goes mainly to the Far East). Increasing the drilling there would only increases oil companies profits (not it seems the US gov't royalties however). But hey, this summer the Saudi's and Qatar offered to send the US more oil to refine into gasoline. The response from the oil companies? "No thanks". And, US refinery capacity was not even at 70% at the time, so forget that arguement. Greed, simple greed. I was in Qatar at the time and they were puzzled by this (and by the fact that diesel was selling for more than regular gas - they just rolled their eyes at that).

It would be nice if the US had taken the lead in developing (and then selling) clean/green technologies. A moon mission approach. Green collar jobs, less foreign oil, fewer US dollars in the pockets of middle east and south american anti-american governments.

What if 7 years ago we took the plunge and committed ourselves to doing that? What would our cities and our economy look like today? Have you been overseas and seen Singapore, China, Dubai, South Korea? Ask yourself who has a 21st century infrastructure, the US or them? We can't keep bridges from falling down or re-build a major US city. The Soviets were a world power because they had nukes, tanks and more than 2 million in their military. I was there in the '70s and again right after the Wall fell. Except for the military hardware there wasn't anything you want to buy or have that they made. We seem to be moving in the same direction (my cars are foreign, as is my cell phone, TV, laptop.......) Both parties suck.

[DeMoore]

Cindy McCain is rich as hell, but what has she done with her life and abundant financial resources? I'll tell you..........Jack $^!#. Just another super rich trust fund baby. I wonder how many of the members here can relate to the McCain family and their boatloads of money. I wasn't aware CZCC had so many well-to-do members.

Like most Americans, I feel the effect of high gas prices. I doubt John and Cindy are remotely phased when they pull up to the pump, and notice gas is $4.00 a gallon. I would be surprised if either of them even pump their own gas.

"Palin shoots" --- Yeah, all sorts of bears and wolves. I'm sure it would be lovely having someone in office that is all for pushing back protected polar bear habitat because she thinks they are "over breeding, and a nuisance". I don't know about you guys, but I certainly don't find to have anything in common with an extremist that gets off to killing wild animals, doesn't believe in "human impact on the environment", and wants to push back protected habitat for more oil drilling. Let me not even mention her whacked out position on women's rights and anti-choice.

I personally find that the Republican party harbor arse-backward views that I think this country needs to begin getting away from. The Republicans have been running this country over the past 8 years, and have put us in the "$^!#" we are now in. Americans just need to realize that it's time for change.

(PS: I'm not aiming to offend anyone, just sharing my views on the subject)

That part in red is absolutely the most ignorant thing I've heard in this election year. Now I don't have time to correct all your ignorance regarding Palin's "anti-choice" stance, (great use of propaganda-speak, we God-fearing people that work and pay taxes for a living actual say "pro-life"), but as for Cindy McCain, you might want to do even a LITTLE research regarding what she's been doing with her life. Here's a little bit to get you started:

There was an article in the Wall Street Journal on Cindy McCain, John's

wife. All I ever saw was this attractive woman standing beside

John. I was surprised how talented and involved with world problems

she is. This is a summary of the article.

She graduated from Southern Cal and was a special-needs

teacher.

After her Dad died she became involved with his beer distributing firm and

is now the chairwoman. Sales have doubled since she has taken over

from her father.

She is involved around the world clearing land mines - travels to these

countries on a detonation team and service on their board

Raised kids in Phoenix, AZ rather than Washington DC.(better

atmosphere) He commuted.

1991, Mrs. McCain came across a girl in an orphanage in Bangladesh.

Mother Teresa implored Mrs. McCain to take the baby with severe cleft

palate. She did so without first telling her husband. The couple

adopted the girl who has had a dozen operations to repair her cleft palate

and other medical problems

They have a Family Foundation for children's causes.

She's extremely active with 'Halo Trust' - to clear land mines, provide water and food in war ravaged and developing countries, more often than not neglecting the comfort of American life.

She has often joined overseas mission of 'Operation Smile', a charity for

corrective surgery on children's faces

Look, I respect the right of a person to have certain opinions, EXCEPT when ignorance comes into play. And with liberals, they base their ENTIRE DOCTRINE around it.

[DeMoore]

Man, we REALLY need to stick to cars here. I stopped going to another forum because of all the political ignorance. At least here we can pretend we're more or less alike because of out love for Z's. Sorry if I blew up, but I still have time to edit it out and I won't. Ther are enough weak and appeasing Republicans in this country.

[Carl Beck]

Long live Ron Paul !!