26th-Z

Mike, To the best of my knowledge, that "poster" does not appear in any of the BRE / Interpart catalogs as the one Peter and Gayle are selling. I think I have all the catalogs however I am aware of other brochures and flyers that I do not own. These picturs may give you an idea of what the colors might be like for the graphic you posted. This was a brochure advertising a performance package that BRE / Interpart marketed for the 510.

I was cruising through Kats' site and following some of his links to other sites. Quite a lot of fun, actually. Most everything is in Japanese which requires some blind clicking without knowing where it will lead to. I stumbled upon a site with pictures of emblems. From what I can understand from the pictures, there are at least two different castings of the Fairlady Z emblem and three of the 432. Evidently, the red paint on the 432 emblem comes in three different shades. This seems to have taken place over a production span between 1969 and 1971.

I think you're right, Mike. The orange one is from Norway and I think I have this picture mis-labeled.

Oh thanks for that reminder photo, Alan. And per some of your comments about 240Z branding, I posted pictures of brochures for export markets other than the U.S. and Canada. We need to do some research and come up with a picture of the shield emblem you talk about. Thanks to Kats for starting yet another great conversation.

Hey thanks for my picture! I'll be damned if I can find it on my computer! Could be the sweltering steam of August has my brain on half throttle. As I recall, I was so happy to have a metal script Fairlady without the Z because all the Fairladys I had seen had big white Zs. But this brings me to a point I would like to make about the Z. I suspect the Z was always part of the car. Whether it was a Fairlady or a 240, it was always a Z. Consider the Zulu. Reference page 46 of Brian Long’s “Datsun Z”. “The targa prototype was trimmed in black leather – the flag on the rear quarter was Katayama’s idea (it’s the naval flag that represents the letter Z).” Studio Sport '70 was working on a design referenced as the Sport Z. Alan, can you confirm the Japanese use of the word "sport" in name descriptions of the S30? We all know that Matsuo's design team was working on a sport replacement for the roadster SP311 – the latest in a long line of sport designs beginning with the DC-3. I suspect the Z represents the connotation of an ambitious design team. “Presenting the ultimate sports car”. Then I would consider that Mr. Katayama already had a Fairlady and wanted something new to market without the old association attached to the roadster. Consider his relationship with Katsuji Kawamata, Nissan’s president who named the Fairlady after the Broadway musical, “My Fair Lady”. We know Mr. Katayama was very brand oriented evidenced by the replacement of the Fairlady Z emblem on the front wings with the brand name Datsun. Reference Long again pages 58 and 59; “The Z in America”. That is Katayama marketing at its finest. “The 240Z represents the imaginative spirit of Nissan… Our product reflects the rapid advancement of our company… It will be the beginning of a new romance for true car lovers who believe that motoring is more than just a commute”. I am more than confident that the 240Z emblem we are discussing is the result of an insistence on a very brand oriented, market identifiable, “signature.” It wasn’t just a Z or the tired Fairlady. It was a Datsun 240-Z Sport.

The 240Z emblem appears on the export model shown at the Tokyo Auto Show in 1969. Time line help please. Wasn't this about the same time that the North American Testing was done? October 1969?

Panasport and Watanabe are two different manufacturers. Although Panasports look like Watanabes, there are differences. Two pictures attached - the Watanabe A spoke and the Watanabe B spoke.

Oh! Well, kick him out of London why don't ya! Is your first picture from Matsuo san? I have the same image - not cropped, of course. I believe the emblem says Nissan, yes. I think all of our pictures of the silver prototype are of the same prototype taken on a roof top plaza.

Just when I begin to think I don't know what I'm talking about, the fates cast their blessing on my karma. Kats is my angel... So much for the so-called "experts"! I was searching through my files looking for that Fairlady emblem I bought from the guy in London who sold me the Datsun film from the Monte Carlo Rallye (can't find it) and I stumbled across this shot of the long lost Zulu emblem. Now, I know this is drifting from what Kats is talking about but I remember a conversation about the Zulu and here is something you are not going to see any day, let alone some days when you run into a chrome Z emblem! First, let me post some pictures of what we are discussing - the infamous chrome Z. I'll let Kats discuss what he has learned about it. Then, the emblem that appears on the Z 432 (PS30) and I believe Alan gets credit for the photo. Finally, a photo of two prototype S30s - the targa top showing the Zulu emblem that I have been told is pure fictional lore from the "experts". I also want to point out that I have other pictures of the silver car behind the targa top car. Notice the 'D' hubcaps? This "car" is not a car at all. It is a clay. Alan, this should interest you. Notice the Nissan emblem on the quarter panel? I believe this is a round Nissan emblem, is it not? But check out the Datsun hubcaps.

I took a solid chrome Z emblem to Long Beach several years ago and talked with Matsuo san about it. I'm anxious to hear what you have, Kats. BTW, I'm still working on the early advertising questions we had several weeks ago.

Yea, the History Channel is great entertainment and they do very nice productions, but they ain't no PHD of history. I advise taking the show with a grain of salt. Take the quote Alan posted; "When creating the 240Z..." What would be more accurate would be: "When creating the image of driving enthusiasm expressed in the 240Z...". What Katayama is expressing is how he wants a driver to feel when driving a 240Z. Connected. As in " having a conversation with the wind" when flying a kite. The metaphor conjures up images of excitement which would pursuade a potential buyer. The History Channel isn't going to lay that rap on the average beer guzzling American for they would switch the channel.

I agree with Ron, Randy. When I dipped 26th, she came home with Swiss cheese in that area. After taking the battery tray out I cut out a rather large void in the inner fender well and bent new metal to weld in place. It most certainly can be done! Eastwood has some "In the Shop" videos we should all watch for insirational metal repair and fabrication. I have a very nice demonstration video about rolling fenders for a custom car and another instructional video about welding metal patches and fabricating new sections. They use a Morgan 3-wheeler as an example. Of course, the main problem is finding someone who has experience and is able.

Oh for goodness sake! Color matters! Ask any woman. I suggest we be very careful about the labels used on the condition of either of these cars. The $19 car isn't any more of a "survivor" than Her Majesty. It is NOT original even though it is a low mileage example. I'm not knocking either car. The $19 car is a superb example and I'll bet with as much money, time and effort, the other eBay car could be made to look as good as the $19 car.

My God! They're coming out of the woodwork!

They made the chrome emblems because Her Majesty the 26th does not look good in white. They made the emblems solid in the very early days because Her Majesty the 26th likes heavy jewelry.

Here's a picture of a real one to compare the eBay car to. I only have this one picture.

Will, That link is several pages. There is a page about the Bob's glove box eBay auction. It looks like the BOD has expanded from what I have seen previously. Looks like a good group of people. CW-

Some of you may be horrified when you find out how much it is going to cost to frame your poster. As much as I admire the talents of a good framer, I have been buying frames and framing large posters for years from pictureframes.com. Check out their collection of metal frames - the "rainbow" line. These frames are thin, screw together, and hold a poster very well. I buy foam-core board at a local art supply shop and glass from a glass shop. Non-glare type glass is best for these larger formats. You order the frames by exact size and everything comes pre-cut. All you have to do is assemble everything. I might also suggest using acid free materials for backer boards or matting; anything that comes in contact with the poster. The acids in normal paper and cardboard will eventually brown the paper of the poster and affect the coloring. Make the same consideration if you decide to dry mount the poster to a board. Dry mounting will prevent the poster from wrinkling inside the frame and works best on thin papers. I'm pretty handy with a matt cutter and have layout tables and bars to do most of this work but it isn't very difficult. Matt board comes in a million colors and matting gives the piece depth and richness.

Just got my Z-Car Club Inland Valley newsletter today. Thought I would post some new info. The Datsun Heritage Museum will host the grand opening September 12-14 (Mr. K's birthday). The address is: 41610 Date Street, Suite 103, Murrieta, California 92562. Phone numbers listed: 951.696.1087 and fax 951.696.9506

Carl, Your statement' "For Nissan's part..." refers to vehicle design, not mechanical design or reliability. And, yes, I believe anything used for "sport" requires maintenance exceeding what might be considered normal. Dauhh! I spent my college summers working on British cars in a shop in Gainesville, raced a British car in SCCA, and drove a British car daily. I have fond recollections of packing everything I owned in an MGB when I left home for school. The first real race car I ever owned was an Alexis. This year marks the 50th anniversary of one of the finest race car manufactuers in the world - a British Company. There is nothing wrong with a British sports car; all jokes about the Prince of Darkness aside. British cars were never marketed very well in America. They sold to a small niche in the automotive market and didn't build a service industry. The "Japanese invasion" was every bit marketing as it was reliability. And frankly, it was more economy than anything else. Toyotas, Subarus, Hondas, and Datsuns were far less expensive to purchase than the limited offerings from Britain. The Japanese provided far better service for their vehicles including ready availability of parts. Those are the sorts of things we can thank Mr. Katayama for. I'm convinced that the Japanese persuaded the American public to buy their cars more than anything else.

Sorry to jump in on this so late. For the record, the pictures I posted on the Kanji thread came from a Nissan Shatai Co; LTD. company brochure circa 1973. It is written in English and about 23 pages. This would be the kind of brochure you would get with the annual report if you owned stock in the company. "To our customers and friends abroad". There are many pictures of the company activities and I only scanned and cropped the images pertaining to the S30. There are many other sketches and the strange coloring of the graphics is part of the brochure graphic theme. Some time ago, I read the book; "William R. Gorham: An American Engineer in Japan" and became interested in the design engineering of the unibody. At the time, I was in the unibody restoration phase of my car, Her Majesty the 26th, when she was stripped to bare metal and I could examine the various welding techniques and panel fabrication. I started collecting pictures of individual body panels I saw on eBay as well as study the various sketches prepared for the parts manuals published by Nissan. I began to see some logic with how the panels were placed to build the structural integrity of the unibody. Then Ron and I got into this e-mail conversation about building the cars in a factory. To give you an idea of the enormity of Nissan Shatai, in 1973 their combined facilities totaled 424,307 square meters, produce 40,000 cars (Datsuns) per month, (600 buses, 500 forklifts) and employed 9,000 people. They were capitalized 4,800 million Yen. Katsuji Kawamata was Chairman of the Board. A little history...The company was formed in 1941 as Niho Kokusai Koku Kogyo Co., LTD with 36 million Yen to manufacture aircraft. Hope everyone enjoys this conversation as much as I do.

I have read that OSPHO is an encapsulator. It has a very low percentage of phosporic acid. I use it all the time for cleaning and metal prep. You are supposed to be able to paint right over it, but I wipe it off. The PPG metal ready is very good and I used it on my car before I primed it. I didn't sand blast my car and I don't agree with sand blasting but wiping it down with metal prep before you apply the primer is a good idea. You can use etching or non-etching primer at this point. It doesn't matter. I used etching primer inside the unibody because I couldn't wipe the metal and I used regular primer on the outside shell afterwiping it down a couple of times. Enrique should be in the conversation. He's the pro. I see no difference between blasted metal and mill finish metal. There is nothing on the metal - it is bare.

I missed a bunch of early parts in Virginia once. I think it has something to do with the water.

Sorry to deviate a little bit. Perhaps this photo helps get us back in the general direction. I suppose, Ron, that the yellow paint was applied at this point when the alignment was set? 26th had yellow paint as this photo shows except there was a dab of red on the left compression rod.

Ron, This sketch evidently didn't make it into my last posts. These came from that booklet Dan sent me when we were having the e-mail conversation some time ago. There just aren't many pictures out there that describe the production process of the S30. And when we talk about the HLS30 and S30 and the PS30 all running on the same line, it is quite difficult to imagine. Then there was the conversation of how sequential serial numbers were painted the same color. Or the conversation of build sheets (the elusive build sheet!) Once I started looking at these pictures and others, a lot of things fell into the logic notches of my brain. Thought the pictures would help everyone understand how when and where all those little scribbles and stamps found their way onto the car.