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240ZBUILTBYME 1971 240z HS-001063 Project Sheena


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Hey Ryan,

Welcome to the group officially now that you have emerged from lurker status! That looks like a great project and it will be fun to see your progress. Your Dad's new shop looks to be well worth the wait. Sweet video, I wish I had some of your talent in this area - we'll all be watching for your future episodes. Your plan for the car is impressive and I think you'll find some like-minded 920 Safari Gold bigots (like me) on this site. A few years ago I sold a restored steering wheel to a chap in Perth. He commented it is the most isolated city in the world!

Regards,

Jim

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Hi Jim

Thanks so much for the warm welcome! Its really so exciting to be starting this build. Yes the shop is nice and spacious but im running out of room with all the parts coming off the car! It needs some upgrades though, no electricity atm, and want to give the place a good clean out! I swear my dads a hoarder. 

Yes Perth is extremely isolated! Not many z's left over here at all, I could count on two hands how many times Ive seen one on the road. Makes them more expensive and parts harder to find. But luckily we have you guys in US to buy parts from. Just have to get a mortgage to pay for the shipping costs!

look forward to using all the knowledge and expertise from my fellow members 

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So thought I would share how rusty this car is. Perth is a fairly sunny and dry place but we get quite wet winters. This old girl has obviously been left out for a few of them...

Basically everything is rusted where it normally is on this car:

  • Outer sills and dog legs
  • rear wheel arches
  • front frame rails
  • floors pans and chassis rails are terrible 
  • rear hatch slam panel
  • rear valance/beaver panel
  • bit in the radiator support
  • front nose area where the headlight buckets bolt to

Some rust that it has where you dont often see is:

  • cowl area and firewall including the double skin reinforcement area above the steering column mount
  • roof frame and roof skin
  • A pillars at the bottom of the rain rail skin/panel 

If anyone has any personal experience in rust repairing the cowl, roof and A pillars please let me know as these are the areas Im a bit unsure of... the normal areas dont scare me but these do!

I uploaded about 40 photos onto the aussie forum and it took me about 4 hours, so Im not doing it again lol sorry...if you would like to check out the rust photos head to https://www.viczcar.com/forums/topic/19913-240zbuiltbyme-project-sheena/ 

 

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so far my plan goes like this (please let me know your thoughts and any advice you can give me!):

  1. Build a Chassis jig, using  this is to make sure the car is straight and level before I brace it and also so that when i come to replace floors, chassis rails, frame rails etc the car stays square and the bolt holes line up. using these plans from ConVerTT  https://www.classiczcars.com/forums/topic/61482-240z-gets-jiggy/
  2. Brace chassis while its on the Jig
  3. Build rotisserie
  4. Off to restoration shop for stripping and epoxy primer. I was considering using something like easyphos instead of epoxy as I dont know how long its going to take me to complete the rust repairs and bodywork and I have read that its not good to have the car sitting in epoxy. Resto shop guy advised easyphos only lasts about 6 months then rust starts up again. He advised car is ok to sit in epoxy as long as it is in an enclosed shed and covered to protect from any moisture in the air. Your Thoughts?
  5. Am thinking its best for the Resto shop to complete repairs on roof, pillars and cowl sections due to complexity of the structures. I think i need to do a roof reskin as to properly repair and rustproof the roof substructure the skin has to come off, chances of reusing the same skin? I would think slim to none, let me know if you know anyone who has reused a roof skin with good results! So I bought a donor roof with a clean skin, my roof structure will need to be repaired. thoughts anyone?
  6. Receive the car back from resto shop with repaired cowl and roof and begin long journey to repair all remaining rust.

Which would be:

  • Floors and chassis rails from KFvintageJDM. Possibly will need to replace seat mounts, need to see what condition they are in after unpicking them.
  • Frame rails from MSA
  • Outer Sills from  kfvintagejdm
  • Front Sill Reinforcement pieces from kfvintagejdm
  • Inner and outer rear wheel arches from MSA
  • Rear slam panel from kfvintagejdm
  • Rear Valance Panel from auto panel solutions
  • Remove Tool compartment skins, patch rust and reinstall 
  • Patch Tyre well 
  • Remove battery tray and do custom bolt in solution
  • Remove radiator support with intention to repair and reuse (has anyone successfully done this?), failing that new piece from fourways engineering ($1800 before shipping!!! will be trying to avoid) or auto panel solutions
  • Complete new LHS door from all muscle parts (Aussie site)
  • reskin RHS door after proper rust proofing of the shell
  • patch front fenders with MSA front fender patch
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2 minutes ago, Patcon said:

I would think you could find better sources for all the metal your are looking at from MSA

I would go epoxy. It's tough and I have never heard of issues. stored inside or not

I was under the understanding that MSA's panels are from zedd findings and Tabco. I tried going direct through tabco but their customer service is non existent. several emails sent, no replies, called them, they said they'd get back to me and never did. 

Where would you recommend Pat?

Yes going to go Epoxy I think.  

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I would go through zed findings or tabco. If you are having trouble with Tabco, maybe somebody on the forum would ship them to you. MSA normaly marks the panels up pretty good. Other better places to spend money than there

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3 minutes ago, Patcon said:

I would go through zed findings or tabco. If you are having trouble with Tabco, maybe somebody on the forum would ship them to you. MSA normaly marks the panels up pretty good. Other better places to spend money than there

Definitely aware there is a mark up on them, however when you ship all the items together from one vendor I would make that money back on savings from the shipping. Its not cheap to send multiple bulky packages from canada, US to the otherside of the world! I get what you're saying though.

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Whoa, I just went through your pics on viczcar, that is quite a project.  You're right to be scared of the A pillar and roof rust, those are the most difficult areas to repair.  The rest of the cars rust, although time consuming is repairable but the A pillars consist of 3-4 layers of tightly folded metal and there is just no room to work in there. You might seriously consider finding a complete rust free roof/A pillar State side and grafting on to your body.

Any chance that there is an acid dipper in Perth, media blasting is great but will never get into the inner cavities of the subframe.  Now I'm all for DIY rust repair, for me it is the process of the project that I enjoy but let me play devils advocate for a second.  If you know you're going to spend 35-40k to get this car on the road then that same kind of money will buy you an awfully nice finished Z.

Looking forward to your progress, this forum is great resource for any problems you run into during the rebuild. Will be interested to see what you think of the KlassicFab panels, they look great.  Pricey but if they are as good as they look it will be worth it.

 

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14 hours ago, grannyknot said:

Whoa, I just went through your pics on viczcar, that is quite a project.  You're right to be scared of the A pillar and roof rust, those are the most difficult areas to repair.  The rest of the cars rust, although time consuming is repairable but the A pillars consist of 3-4 layers of tightly folded metal and there is just no room to work in there. You might seriously consider finding a complete rust free roof/A pillar State side and grafting on to your body.

Any chance that there is an acid dipper in Perth, media blasting is great but will never get into the inner cavities of the subframe.  Now I'm all for DIY rust repair, for me it is the process of the project that I enjoy but let me play devils advocate for a second.  If you know you're going to spend 35-40k to get this car on the road then that same kind of money will buy you an awfully nice finished Z.

Looking forward to your progress, this forum is great resource for any problems you run into during the rebuild. Will be interested to see what you think of the KlassicFab panels, they look great.  Pricey but if they are as good as they look it will be worth it.

 

Hi mate!

Yes very concerned about the A pillars. Im getting a restoration shop to complete the A pillar/cowl and roof repairs as I believe these are a bit out of my league. I will do the remaining rust repairs using the replacement panels and there might be a few random spots ill have to make up little patch pieces for. 

Unfortunately there is no acid dipping in Perth. Perths population is only about 2 million people so I guess theres not enough classic cars or demand for it over here. I was just going to use something like eastwoods internal frame coating, have seen some youtube videos of independent testing on rusted metals and it seems to encapsulate it quite well. not much else I can do really..

haha I have had this discussion already with a few people, unfortunately 240z's are pretty expensive here, for a restored 240z you're looking at 60-80k AUD. (roughly 43-60k USD), unrestored clean barn finds are one in a million now in Australia and they normally get snapped up before they even get advertised, even rarer in perth due to the isolation/distance from eastern cities and low population. 

For me Im not interested in buying someone elses restoration, I want to create a bond with the car and memories to go with it, and at the end of the day achieve something I can be proud of at the end of it all. Now thats looking through rose coloured glasses I know, and Im sure im going to be on the verge of throwing in the towel on numerous occasions throughout this resto. 

I bought this car 10 years ago for $5k AUD ($3600 USD). So if I spend 40k AUD ($29000 USD) restoring it I will still be ahead once its complete. Not that Im going to sell it!

 

 

Edited by 240ZBUILTBYME
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So small update

shipment from KFvintageJDM is on its way! Found their customer service very good. My master plan did not work, was going to try and have KF and MSA both ship to my shipito address and send all as one shipment to save on shipping cost however MSA didn't have stock of half my items!!! Sooooo back to the drawing board...

KF shipment is coming direct from Bogota Colombia 

MSA shipment will leave once all stock is received in 2-4 weeks... MSA is so bad in responding to emails....

Also I purchased about $900 worth of steel to start building my chassis jig and rotisserie, due for delivery to dads shed on Monday!

Have I mentioned Ive never really welded??? :-\ Ok I lie, I welded once about a month ago...

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On 9/5/2020 at 9:30 AM, grannyknot said:

Will be interested to see what you think of the KlassicFab panels, they look great.

I also have a shipment from KFVintageJDM on the way.  As per your experience, the shipment emanated from Bogota.  I, too, have found the company's customer service to be excellent -- fast replies, helpful and on-topic information.  Shipping was by way of FedEx and the costs were surprisingly modest.  I'm using a USA-to-Canada cross-border trans-shipper service recommended to me by Grannyknot and hope to take delivery at their Toronto drop site sometime next week. 

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18 hours ago, 240ZBUILTBYME said:

Have I mentioned Ive never really welded??? :-\ Ok I lie, I welded once about a month ago...

If it's gas Mig you'll pick it up quickly, it's very forgiving, however Datsun sheet metal is not, it tries to blow holes in itself. Start with small tack weld for the panels, jump around letting them cool and eventually join them all up.

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16 hours ago, Namerow said:

I also have a shipment from KFVintageJDM on the way.  As per your experience, the shipment emanated from Bogota.  I, too, have found the company's customer service to be excellent -- fast replies, helpful and on-topic information.  Shipping was by way of FedEx and the costs were surprisingly modest.  I'm using a USA-to-Canada cross-border trans-shipper service recommended to me by Grannyknot and hope to take delivery at their Toronto drop site sometime next week. 

Nice! good to hear the experience with KF is universal, I think MSA and tabco/zedd findings will be losing some business. Seems like better quality at a similar price with better customer service experience. they should do well. 

Mine was fedex aswell and Im suprised how quickly it got to australia, currently on the east coast but should be on the west coast within the week! cost of shipping was better than I expected too!

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7 hours ago, grannyknot said:

If it's gas Mig you'll pick it up quickly, it's very forgiving, however Datsun sheet metal is not, it tries to blow holes in itself. Start with small tack weld for the panels, jump around letting them cool and eventually join them all up.

Thanks Grannyknot! thats my plan, slow and steady.... with your buttwelds do you leave a gap or butt each sheet right up? obviously too big a gap equals more blow holes than a pod of whales 

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