BoldUlysses

Bodywork Issues

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    So...I'm realizing that I should have been a lot more involved in the body restoration of our Z.  I did all the disassembly and I'm doing all the reassembly, but the body was restored by a shop near where my dad lives, about 450 miles away.  Of note, the body shop didn't have any specific Z restoration experience, and it kind of shows.

    Two questions for today.  See attached pics. 

    1. The passenger side of the hatch sits flush with the roof, but the driver's side is elevated.  It wasn't like this before.  The adjustment slots for the hinge don't have enough travel to bring the edge down.  Any ideas as to what might have happened and how I can line it up?

    2. The hatch sill was rusted so the shop welded on a new piece.  The rear lip is turned down, as shown.  Is this how it's supposed to be?  I can't find any close-ups online to compare.  It doesn't mate with top corner of the rear finisher panels.  There are also no holes for the finisher panel rivets.  Any input here would be helpful also.

    Thanks again guys.  She's coming together...

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    A guess on the hatch roof line is the hatch bracket is bent or the weld is cracked

    I have to stretch my tail light finishers just a little to go over the slam panel

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    They might have reversed the hatch hinges, also the hatch seal is new and until it relaxes with time and heat it can push the hatch up.  Can you take some pics of the hatch hinges? Normally there is plenty of adjustment room.

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    Hatch alignment can be a pain in the glass... sorry.

    I would suggest removing the main weather stripping and getting the hatch to fit without it. Not an easy decision, but it will remove the main impediment to adjusting things and being able to tell if your adjustment is doing what you think.

    The hinges do have a L and and R stamped in them somewhere. Do make sure you have them on the right side, though I’m not sure why them being wrong would cause one side to be higher than the other.  You never know.

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    Yeah, need pics of the hatch to hinge attachment areas, and pics of the hinges with left and right marked.  Also, pic with hatch adjusted as well as you can currently, with back edge at proper height would be helpful to determine how far out the whole thing is.  Need to see gaps on all four sides...

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    Thanks for the input guys.  Here are pics of the hinges.  They look identical to me re:alignment, so what accounts for the difference in hatch height when it's closed?  I've attached a pic of the passenger side of the hatch also.  It's actually marginally below the edge of the roof / C-pillar.

    FYI the car was repainted in its original 901 Silver (it had been blue since the late '70s, which is why the hinge bolts are blue---another thing I need to fix).

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    I had the same problem with the alignment of my rear hatch.  I was a little concerned because my body man replaced a hatch lid hinge.  Then he turned into a d*** in the later stages of the repair work and then killed himself shortly thereafter. So I couldn't take it back to him.

     This is how I got mine aligned.   I figured out first of all that the hatch cylinder that I had was slightly too long.  But not by much. I took it completely off and replaced it with the correct size after I was finished.  I could see it stressing the mounting bracket above the strut tower each time I closed it all the way.

    Then I loosened all 4 bolts and allowed it to relax.  The driver side still sits up a little high by about 1/16-1/8 inch and I don't have my rear glass or latch installed so it might be good now but if yet but if not, the gaps are marginal now. 

    I should note, it took several times for me to get it right.  I had to repaint my bolts because of my repeated  attempts.

    Edited by 87mj

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    8 hours ago, BoldUlysses said:

    so what accounts for the difference in hatch height when it's closed? 

    I would loosen by a few turns both bolts on the D/S and the inboard bolt on the P/S then with the hatch still in the open position push down on the D/S to try and get the D/S hinge to sit lower in the pocket.  Once you have it as low as it will go tighten the bolts while pushing down and then see what that looks like when closed.  When the bolts are loose you may have to pivot the hatch on the far P/S bolt a few times to break the  paint around the edges of the hinge.

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    Also, you should remove the chunks of body filler, or seam sealer or whatever it is (like above outer corner of right hinge) so that the hinges can be moved as needed.  It looks like on the right one, that blob is keeping the hinge from moving up, which it sounds like it needs to, in order to make the panel sit level with the body on that side.  Left one doesn't appear to be "clean" of residual stuff either, so that could be limiting it's movement.  Inspect your weather strips and the flanges they are attached to.  It could be that the flange the main seal is on is bent upward a bit in the left corner.  

    That right hinge has an R on it, correct?  Can't tell from the pic.

    The hinges are pretty beefy, so I doubt they are bent... or the issue.  The mounting flanges on the hatch don't move around easily either.  Doubt that is the problem. 

    So, how is the fit at the bottom of the hatch? Left side to quarter panel, right side to quarter panel, and rear bottom edge from side to side?  If the left front corner is elevated, the left rear should be elevated also.

    Edited by inline6

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    On 1/20/2020 at 7:12 AM, grannyknot said:

    I would loosen by a few turns both bolts on the D/S and the inboard bolt on the P/S then with the hatch still in the open position push down on the D/S to try and get the D/S hinge to sit lower in the pocket.  Once you have it as low as it will go tighten the bolts while pushing down and then see what that looks like when closed.  When the bolts are loose you may have to pivot the hatch on the far P/S bolt a few times to break the  paint around the edges of the hinge.

    ^This worked like a charm!  Thank you SO much.  Perfectly aligned now.

    So, two more questions:

    1. Can anyone snap a photo of their rear hatch sill lip WITHOUT the finisher panels attached?  Still unsure of how to make that work, see post #1 in this thread.

    2. The hatch is still about 1/4" misaligned at the rear.  Can I remove the shims under the hinges and move it forward, or is there another adjustment method for this direction?

     

     

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    Yes, you can remove the shims under the hinges. which will move it forward, but you have to be very careful the hatch lip doesn't contact the roof! It will remove the paint really quickly if it does.

    The hatch looks like it might still be a touch lower than the roof which will add to potential interference

     

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    Hopefully, this image is helpful.  The hatch sill plate on this car is factory.  The passenger taillight surround is installed but the piece behind the license plate is not.

    Please let me know if you need another angle.

    Thanks

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    On 1/19/2020 at 4:00 PM, BoldUlysses said:

    . The hatch sill was rusted so the shop welded on a new piece.  The rear lip is turned down, as shown.  Is this how it's supposed to be?  I can't find any close-ups online to compare.  It doesn't mate with top corner of the rear finisher panels.  There are also no holes for the finisher panel rivets.  Any input here would be helpful also.

    It looks like the lip on the new sill plate is a bit longer than it should be and the lip needs to be pushed down some so the finisher can slip over top. You could take a block of wood, place it on the edge of lip and with a hammer tap the wood while moving it along the lip, it looks like you only need to move it down about an 1/8". If the paint cracks you'll have to touch that up before installing the finisher.

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    22 hours ago, Patcon said:

    Yes, you can remove the shims under the hinges. which will move it forward, but you have to be very careful the hatch lip doesn't contact the roof! It will remove the paint really quickly if it does.

    The hatch looks like it might still be a touch lower than the roof which will add to potential interference

     

    10-4.  Thanks for the warning.  It's pretty close when opening as-is.  Will be careful.

     

     

    9 hours ago, 87mj said:

    Hopefully, this image is helpful.  The hatch sill plate on this car is factory.  The passenger taillight surround is installed but the piece behind the license plate is not.

    Please let me know if you need another angle.

    Thanks

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    Yes that's very helpful!  Thank you!  So it looks like the lip on the end of the sill is supposed to be more like a 90° angle down.

    9 hours ago, grannyknot said:

    It looks like the lip on the new sill plate is a bit longer than it should be and the lip needs to be pushed down some so the finisher can slip over top. You could take a block of wood, place it on the edge of lip and with a hammer tap the wood while moving it along the lip, it looks like you only need to move it down about an 1/8". If the paint cracks you'll have to touch that up before installing the finisher.

    Got it; I'll try that.  If/when the paint cracks in the process of bending that lip a little further toward 90°, I'm glad it will be hidden by the finisher---but I've got a bottle of touchup 901 silver just in case.  Thanks!

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    @BoldUlysses: What paint (manufacturer of the 901 Silver) did you go with?  I tried asking for Glasurit/BASF/Limco, and they had no formula/code for it.

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