DatsunZGuy

Mint '71 240Z - More Fun Coming to BaT

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    And you guys are quoting six digit serial numbers.  Nissan included.  They were five digit serial numbers up 120001 in July 72.

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    2 hours ago, 240260280 said:

     

    Nissan seems to have done this in many documents. Here it is from microfiche:

    image.png

    While the Date Range is wrong - the chassis serial number ranges are correct according to the Service Bulletins.

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    27 minutes ago, 26th-Z said:

    And you guys are quoting six digit serial numbers.  Nissan included.  They were five digit serial numbers up 120001 in July 72.

    Chris, I'd say they were five digit serial number up to 100000 - -  HLS30 100095 had a date of Mfg. of 08/72  and the highest VIN for a 72 Model we have found so far is #101398 in Portugal. 

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    48 minutes ago, Carl Beck said:

    I certainly did not coin the term - I’m not that OLD!  

    Yes you are!!!  Ha, ha!  I'm catching up to you Carl.  I certainly didn't mean anything derogatory.  I was reminiscing back to the e-mail blog days.

    Based on the Service Bulletin describing the "late model", it is very easy to see how this can be described by "series".

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    This all makes sense now. Nissan called them the S30 Series, based on that we have the 1st Series, 2nd Series, 3rd Series and 4th Series of the S30 Model. Easy to understand how it got changed to Series 1, Series 2 etc. over the years.

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    31 minutes ago, SpeedRoo said:

    This all makes sense now. Nissan called them the S30 Series, based on that we have the 1st Series, 2nd Series, 3rd Series and 4th Series of the S30 Model. Easy to understand how it got changed to Series 1, Series 2 etc. over the years.

    But it clashes with the fact that Nissan used the word SERIES to denote specific groups of sub variants, hence 510-series, C10-series, B110-series etc etc, as portrayed by my factory service manual lineup photo up-thread. 

    The whole point of Nissan using the term S30-series at launch was that they considered each of the variants at launch (and therefore through concept, design, engineering and production) to be part of a series. Hence 'base model' is S30, joined by S30-S, PS30, PS30-SB, HLS30, HLS30U/N/V, HS30U etc.

    Look through any of Nissan's Series line-ups and you will see the same pattern of use.

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    1 hour ago, Carl Beck said:

    ...and the highest VIN for a 72 Model we have found so far is #101398 in Portugal

    "72 Model" a term used in the Portuguese market? That's not how they were sold there.

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    31 minutes ago, HS30-H said:

    But it clashes with the fact that Nissan used the word SERIES to denote specific groups of sub variants, hence 510-series, C10-series, B110-series etc etc, as portrayed by my factory service manual lineup photo up-thread. 

    The whole point of Nissan using the term S30-series at launch was that they considered each of the variants at launch (and therefore through concept, design, engineering and production) to be part of a series. Hence 'base model' is S30, joined by S30-S, PS30, PS30-SB, HLS30, HLS30U/N/V, HS30U etc.

    Look through any of Nissan's Series line-ups and you will see the same pattern of use.

    Just another example of those honorable Japanese gentleman at Nissan stretching the truth....like they did with the power figures for the engines! Seems to be the pattern of use to their official statements.

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    9 minutes ago, SpeedRoo said:

    Just another example of those honorable Japanese gentleman at Nissan stretching the truth....like they did with the power figures for the engines! Seems to be the pattern of use to their official statements.

    What's not true? All the factory documentation says that S30 is the Series. 

    Export chassis tags say "Max HP at X RPM". Hardly a lie, is it? If you're looking for stretched truth try the people who misinterpret the figures.

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     Whether Series 1 - 2 or 3 is an original Nissan term is irrelevant, IMO. The fact is the terms Series 1, etc terms are a better way to reflect changes than the model years. 

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    7 hours ago, SpeedRoo said:

    Just another example of those honorable Japanese gentleman at Nissan stretching the truth....like they did with the power figures for the engines! Seems to be the pattern of use to their official statements.

    I think you may be describing a universal truth about most marketing departments. Based on my experience, no one was better at lying about power numbers than the famous Italian Marques of the same era.  There’s a pretty good reason why Lamborghini vaulted all the build sheets (with their dyno numbers)  for customer cars- can you imagine the PR nightmare that would ensue when your 325BHP Miura showed 275-and-change on the factory dyno?

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    Let’s have a break  , before I am going to post about chassis number . 

    How about my seats ? Looks good as re-upholstery seats. Later slim type used palm sheet in the seat back and bottom.

    Kats

    063D41A0-1046-4557-86DE-FCED99BA7539.jpeg

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    FF1D6540-563B-4ABE-A9D2-AB46BDF8682C.png

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    Hello,

    I’m restoring a VIN 145xxx EU car. But never seen bumpers with those reinforcements.

    By the way Kats, your seats are great!

    A181A431-178C-478A-A894-42F4B8453EA9.jpeg

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    1 hour ago, christoffel said:

    Hello,

    I’m restoring a VIN 145xxx EU car. But never seen bumpers with those reinforcements.

    DDE17B65-5243-4BE4-8AC9-EFBFA83388D1.jpeg

     

    E8100 late 'Europe' type.

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    9 hours ago, Mark Maras said:

     Whether Series 1 - 2 or 3 is an original Nissan term is irrelevant, IMO. The fact is the terms Series 1, etc terms are a better way to reflect changes than the model years. 

    I disagree. First of all, the choice of the word 'Series' clashes with Nissan's own methodology, but secondly these vernacular 'Series' numbers are not accurate descriptors for individual car content. And that's what they are tending to be used for.

    Example: @26th-Z Chris' HLS30-00026 will be described as a 'Series 1', so what will have been the content of the car when it rolled off the production line in 1969? Would it have had carpets? Would it have had a heated rear window? Would it have had a splash pan? 

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the answers to those three questions for that particular car would be no, no and no. So are these three details 'Series 1' characteristics? I don't believe they are. And that's without going into the (stop me if you've heard this one before...) 'Made For USA' type mindsets - as seen on the comments for this 310kUSD BaT car - which seem oblivious to the fact that there were other variants, with different content, on the drawing board and on the production line at the same time...

    I can see why the terms came about - as a necessity to pigeonhole after the fact - but the word 'Series' was a bad choice. Production date, market variant and chassis prefix + body serial number combo are still the best way to define an individual car.            

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    We, Datsun dealer personnel in the US,  were taught, by the factory, to identify cars by production date and model name, i.e. 3/72  510 2 door.  It was explained to us as being the best way to get the correct parts from the mechanic's parts counter in the dealership. Not trying to be argumentative - just stating the historical record as experienced by me.

     

    PS I worked in Datsun dealers as a mechanic from 1970-1980 

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    44 minutes ago, zspert said:

    We, Datsun dealer personnel in the US,  were taught, by the factory, to identify cars by production date and model name, i.e. 3/72  510 2 door.  It was explained to us as being the best way to get the correct parts from the mechanic's parts counter in the dealership. Not trying to be argumentative - just stating the historical record as experienced by me.

     

    PS I worked in Datsun dealers as a mechanic from 1970-1980 

    And that's the correct way, if you look in the factory parts manuals it shows chassis ranges, but also production dates as guides for part no's. If you called a dealer and said it was a series 1 you needed a part for, they may send you the wrong part!

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    14 hours ago, Mark Maras said:

     Whether Series 1 - 2 or 3 is an original Nissan term is irrelevant, IMO. The fact is the terms Series 1, etc terms are a better way to reflect changes than the model years. 

    It is definitely NOT. 

    S30 = SERIES  ( chassis )

     

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    You are not wrong, Alan.  It goes a little deeper than that, IMO.  My two 1969 builds have different parts than the car on BaT.  Inspection lid clips, rubber hood bumpers, and badging to name but three.  My inspection lids have little tabs riveted on and all my badging is metal including solid chrome Zs on the quarter panels.  To the best of my knowledge, both cars had carpeting fitted at the port of entry.  ( I was so lucky years ago to find a brand new piece of clear hatch glass )

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    21 minutes ago, 26th-Z said:

    To the best of my knowledge, both cars had carpeting fitted at the port of entry.  ( I was so lucky years ago to find a brand new piece of clear hatch glass )

    Funny enough all AU market cars had the clear glass. I actually want the vertical defrost glass. It was later I discovered the early 69 build cars had the clear glass only in North America.

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    21 hours ago, kats said:

    Let’s have a break  , before I am going to post about chassis number . 

    How about my seats ? Looks good as re-upholstery seats. Later slim type used palm sheet in the seat back and bottom.

    Kats

    063D41A0-1046-4557-86DE-FCED99BA7539.jpeg

    BACC834C-BBEE-4BA4-8C29-1F90D3A51102.jpeg

    C2423622-8D01-444D-8A0E-FDDEA7567B41.png

    FF1D6540-563B-4ABE-A9D2-AB46BDF8682C.png

    Hi Kats. Are the blue seat covers reproductions? If so, how does the color match to the original set covers? Where did you buy them? Thanks!

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    15 minutes ago, Gav240z said:

    Funny enough all AU market cars had the clear glass. I actually want the vertical defrost glass. It was later I discovered the early 69 build cars had the clear glass only in North America.

    Not forgetting that the S30-S 'Z-Std'/Standard model for the Japanese market got the non-defrost rear glass from '69 (HRW an extra cost showroom option on that model) whilst the 'Deluxe' models - PS30 Fairlady Z432 and S30 Fairlady Z-L - got it as standard equipment.

    I've got a vertical-element heated rear window in the back of the garages somewhere. Standard equipment on UK market cars (guess why). You're welcome to have it. Probably got the switch and harness sections too. You might need it soon. New ice age on the way, apparently...

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    36 minutes ago, HS30-H said:

    Not forgetting that the S30-S 'Z-Std'/Standard model for the Japanese market got the non-defrost rear glass from '69 (HRW an extra cost showroom option on that model) whilst the 'Deluxe' models - PS30 Fairlady Z432 and S30 Fairlady Z-L - got it as standard equipment.

    I've got a vertical-element heated rear window in the back of the garages somewhere. Standard equipment on UK market cars (guess why). You're welcome to have it. Probably got the switch and harness sections too. You might need it soon. New ice age on the way, apparently...

    Funny, I have been looking for some years for clear glass rear glass for one of my 69's. But didn't know Australian cars had it. Knew about the Japanese cars. Finally found it in the US from a Fairlady Z...

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    1 hour ago, 26th-Z said:

    You are not wrong, Alan.  It goes a little deeper than that, IMO.  My two 1969 builds have different parts than the car on BaT.  Inspection lid clips, rubber hood bumpers, and badging to name but three.  My inspection lids have little tabs riveted on and all my badging is metal including solid chrome Zs on the quarter panels.  To the best of my knowledge, both cars had carpeting fitted at the port of entry.  ( I was so lucky years ago to find a brand new piece of clear hatch glass )

    Even the body of a 69 has many differences, as has the frontbumper etc etc etc etc Too many to list!

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