Engine only runs with starter fluid

[psdenno]

Before I had my carbs rebuilt a few months ago, I opened and resealed the float bowls several times to check floats and valves.  As mentioned, the thin cork gaskets are reusable to a point.  Replacements were just a dollar and change from my local Nissan dealer.   They do seem to prefer being handled by tiny hands and sometimes get a little twisty.  As with about everything else on a Z patience helps.

Dennis

[rossiz]

yes, fuel-resistant rtv and glue it to the lid - much easier to get it lined up w/the fastener holes when you have the lid in your hand. only need a thin bit of rtv, then put the lid back on w/fasteners just lightly snugged and your gasket will be glued on nice and flat. don't gloop the rtv all over and let it set w/the lid off, or you'll wind up w/a lumpy gasket that won't seal due to the high points.

it ain't rocket science, just be clean & patient and it'll be fine.

[hatepotholez]

Thanks guys!

[siteunseen]

2 hours ago, hatepotholez said:

Thanks guys!

Awe come on! Don't leave us hanging. Is everything okay? Runs like a "scalded" dog now?

[hatepotholez]

 wouldn't leave you guys hanging. I bought some plugs that I am going to replace. That should really fire her up!

[hatepotholez]

On 4/1/2016 at 5:12 PM, siteunseen said:

Awe come on! Don't leave us hanging. Is everything okay? Runs like a "scalded" dog now?

sorry for the long post...

So getting a little frustrated with the Z.

I spent the last 2 days working on it, and barely made any progress. The car still won't stay on without help of the throttle and the distributor is completely out of it's range to get it running.

Carbs:

The front carb doesn't get gas into the bowls, I honestly don't know what I am doing wrong. I bought a new rebuild kit and rebuilt the carbs. I am getting gas to the front carb banjo but not into the bowl. The rear carb is getting gas just fine. I tested the needle on the front carb to make sure it works. I removed the float and had my friend sit in the car and rev the car up and down and saw plenty of gas come out, I then installed the float and lifted it up and no gas came out. This leads to me to think the float is the issue. I think when I install the float into the bowl it gets stuck in the up position then causing the needle to stop flowing gas. By the way I am inserting the float and then turning the plate clockwise so I can get it in. I cannot install the float/plate assembly without rotating the plate counterclockwise to get it out and then clockwise to get it in.

Timing:

I have a big issue with the timing. My distributor is completely off the range, by that I mean I have to literally rotate the distributor far past the lock down screw to get the car to run. When everything was aligned, #1cyl tdc, crank at the first mark, the tong was not at the 11:25 position. This is what made me drop the oil pump and realign the shaft.

Here's what I did/happened:

-Did valve adjustments, intake @.20mm and exhaust @.25mm.

-Put cyl 1 in TDC compression stroke, checked by inserting a screw driver and saw the piston is on top, checked cyl 1 lobes and they were up and to the side. Then saw the pointer was on the first timing mark(which can be unreliable) on the crankshaft pulley looking from the passenger side.

-dropped the oil pump and reinserted the distributor shaft and confirmed the tong was at the 11:25 position with the small offset pointing towards the radiator.

-installed the distributor, rotor was at the 8:10 position or the drivers side headlight direction looking from the drivers side. Installed plug wires in counter clock wise order 153624 with #1 spark plug wire right before the rotor.

-car still didn't run but kept kicking like it wanted too.

-moved all the wires counterclockwise by 1, this made it worse and the car didn't even try to start.

-checked for spark, which there was.

-put the wires back in the original position.

-removed the lock nut and rotated the distributor past the lock nut. Car runs and maintains to stay on with lite throttle application.

stumped at this point. 

photos are of the distributor with the car running. 

I appreciate any help with this, losing my hair at this point.

 

Edited December 31, 2016 by hatepotholez

[Zed Head]

No timing light?  I don't see any measurements.  The engineers put those degree marks on for an important reason.  It's important.  If you've confirmed where zero is, with your screwdriver method, then you can set ignition timing to its correct spot.  If you set and measure spark at the correct spot then you don't have a timing issue anymore.  When you have that locked down then you'll know that your problems are somewhere else.  Best not to solve two problems at the same time.

You're lucky in that you have an engine that runs.  From here it's a matter of confirming what's right, and making the stuff that isn't, is.

[hatepotholez]

2 minutes ago, Zed Head said:

No timing light?  I don't see any measurements.  The engineers put those degree marks on for an important reason.  It's important.  If you've confirmed where zero is, with your screwdriver method, then you can set ignition timing to its correct spot.  If you set and measure spark at the correct spot then you don't have a timing issue anymore.  When you have that locked down then you'll know that your problems are somewhere else.  Best not to solve two problems at the same time.

You're lucky in that you have an engine that runs.  From here it's a matter of confirming what's right, and making the stuff that isn't, is.

 

I do have a timing light, but I didn't use it. I was under the assumption that if everything was at zero and aligned the car would atleast idle on it's own(granted the carbs are all set) and then I can use the timing light on it. But even then the engine won't stay on within the lock nut range.

[Zed Head]

10 degrees is a good starting point.  Zero is not the best.  

Sounds like you have the right idea though.  Get the ignition timing right, then focus on the carbs.  But even there, if once carb doesn't have fuel, that's kind of a "needs to be fixed" thing right off the bat.

I'd focus on getting the carb to function properly (gas in the bowl), and setting the timing to 10 degrees.  That's a "should idle" point, then build off of that.

As far as setting timing, even if you have to squirt starting fluid and rev the engine up and down, you should be able to see where the low point is.  Set it to 10 and assume that it's right.  Sometimes you have to make an assumption and work with it for a while.

[hatepotholez]

2 minutes ago, Zed Head said:

10 degrees is a good starting point.  Zero is not the best.  

Sounds like you have the right idea though.  Get the ignition timing right, then focus on the carbs.  But even there, if once carb doesn't have fuel, that's kind of a "needs to be fixed" thing right off the bat.

I'd focus on getting the carb to function properly (gas in the bowl), and setting the timing to 10 degrees.  That's a "should idle" point, then build off of that.

As far as setting timing, even if you have to squirt starting fluid and rev the engine up and down, you should be able to see where the low point is.  Set it to 10 and assume that it's right.  Sometimes you have to make an assumption and work with it for a while.

Ok thanks that makes sense. So this would be the third mark on the crank pulley? And then center the distributor in the lock range? I am sorry i'm asking a lot of questions, new to classic cars.

I hope changing the front float will fix the no gas issue, it always stops working when I insert the float into the bowl. The float might not be aligned. 

 

[Zed Head]

I wouldn't worry too much about where the distributor adjustments are, if the timing light shows you're right.  All you care about is when the spark happens, not where the nuts and bolts are.  Each mark is 5 degrees so the third should be 10.  10 degrees of advance will give you a faster stronger idle than zero.  Get that set and see if you can get it to idle on its own.  Then you can tweak and tune to make it work better.

[hatepotholez]

2 minutes ago, Zed Head said:

I wouldn't worry too much about where the distributor adjustments are, if the timing light shows you're right.  All you care about is when the spark happens, not where the nuts and bolts are.  Each mark is 5 degrees so the third should be 10.  10 degrees of advance will give you a faster stronger idle than zero.  Get that set and see if you can get it to idle on its own.  Then you can tweak and tune to make it work better.

ok thanks!