what damage makes a Z unrestoreable

[rturbo 930]

Well, for whatever it may be worth, my next (and hopefully last) Z, I am pretty much looking for as solid and straight rolling shell as could possibly be found without having already been restored, and the rest is all gravy. Basically, I want a shell that is exactly the way it came out of the factory. No sunroof, body work, rust, flares, etc. Also, I would prefer all the parts be there, though I'm not too concerned about the interior, or other items that tend to wear out. I've got a lot of parts. What I don't have is a good shell. I'm fine with mechanical work. Rust repair... really don't want to deal with it.

[MEZZZ]

I would have to add my vote for rust first and foremost. I am in the "rust belt" and bought one out west that was "rust free". I figured I would rather pay the shipping than deal with rust repair. I looked at the few examples for sale within a 2 hour drive of Cincinnati and wouldnt touch any of them.

While my car wasnt totally rust free, it was relatively so and worth the freight I paid to get it here. I will say, that by the time I am finished with it, I am sure I will have more in it than I should but it has been a learning experience.

I only wish I had more time, money and energy to put into it. Work, family, life gets in the way too much

[Arne]

The point here is what is your threshold...Let others tell their own story...

OK, if that's what you want. But I still feel that without context or background, a whole bunch of individual opinions means little. For example, in parts of the world where S30s are very rare, a well-heeled enthusiast may answer that ANY halfway intact S30 is restorable, regardless of rust, originality or damage.

But to a person who knows nothing of the background of that answer, and who lives in So. Cal where solid Zs are relatively plentiful, that answer without context looks like insanity, and nothing is learned.

So if we are going to share our own specifics, I think some basic info is also needed. Things like location, how common are S30s where you live, typical condition of same, restoration skill set, and very vague financial situation. Without that background, the answers are meaningless.

<hr>

That said, I'll go first. I'm 53 years old, and live in Western Oregon, USA. As with much of the West coast, Zs are relatively plentiful here, and since Oregon has never used road salt, rust is much less a problem here than in many places, despite the rather damp Winters and Springs. I have above average mechanical and electrical abilities, and can do interior work, but have to farm out my welding, body and paint. I'm not wealthy, but not strapped, either. I can afford significant outlays with a bit of advance planning.

So if I were to start over right now and start looking for an S30...

Show-stoppers (any one of these items will make me pass on one)

• Rust in TC rod mounts
  
• Visible signs of severe accident damage
  
• Incomplete color change (doesn't have to be a stock color, but the interior and engine compartments better be the same color as the outside)
  
• Non-L-series engine swaps
  
• Fender flares or other mods that required cutting the original body shell
  

Plusses (things that add to the desireableness, but aren't absolutely required)

• Original engine
  
• Mostly original condition
  
• Virtually no rust
  

Big minuses (no single one of these would cause me to pass, but any two probably would, and three or more is a definite pass)

• Severe battery box rust
  
• Severe hatch tray rust
  
• Rust in quarter panels (fender lips and/or around fuel filler)
  
• Butchered wiring
  
• Sunroof (in a car that doesn't need paint otherwise)
  
• Lots of missing or bad interior parts
  

Small minuses (would take several of these combined to pass on one, but fewer if combined with a Big minus above)

• Automatic transmission
  
• Sunroof (in a car that will need paint anyway)
  
• Dogleg rust
  
• Floorpan rust
  
• Rocker panel rust
  
• Minor rust in battery box
  
• Minor hatch tray rust
  
• General lack of straight body panels (especially roof)
  
• Missing or bent bumpers
  

That's pretty much it, I think. If you look at the three 240Zs I've had and compare to these rules:

• Yellow car - I worked on the yellow car while I thought it had several small minuses and one plus. But I reversed course and parted it out as soon as I found the TC rod mount rust (a show-stopper).
  
• Blue car - Bought as a parts car only due to major accident damage (show-stopper)
  
• Current red car - All three plusses, no show-stoppers, no big minuses, and only one small minus (the sunroof which was handled when I had it painted).
  

Edited May 6, 2010 by Arne

[hls30.com]

Arne,

Thanks for making the location point, I knew I could count on you-and for posting your take-if the newby notices all complete member profiles list location...to tie in to your point.

[Arne]

A couple of other things I missed. How soon will you need to use the car as a regular driver? Do you have a long-term work area or garage for it?

If I need a car that I can drive regularly right away, can't afford to have it off the road for weeks, months or years at a time while major parts of the project are underway, that completely changes how I would look at a potential car.

And this is one area I see a lot of problems with. Many of the younger generation of Z enthusiasts want to buy a Z and do a slow refresh on it while using it as a daily driver - indeed, it is often intended to be their only car. So they go out and get a Z that would be a perfectly viable restoration or refresh project if they had time and/or space to really work on it. But they need it on the road NOW!

Time and workspace pressures could make me add other Small minuses, move some of the Small minuses into Big minuses, and some of the Big minuses into Show-stoppers.

[stevef1972z]

I agree with Arne on the fact that geography plays a part.

Here in the St. Louis Metro area you will not find a car with little or no rust. You know you will be doing floors, rockers and quarters, there may be even more. It does not matter if it is a Zed, a Mustang, or a Camaro here if you want one you either have to build it or pay more than the value of the car to transport it in.

I have more time and money in my 72 than it is worth. Lets face it these are not Hemi muscle cars, Boss 429s, or COPO Camaros. Fully restored they are not worht the cost of a total body resto and rebuild. They are built and rescued because they are cool, thats why I have more time in working on the car than driving it. I like the car so it is worth it. Someone will offer me something for it one day, and I will use that to start the next one.

Time, money and skill determine if a car can be brought back by the owner, or farmed out. The desire of the owner for the final product, concours resto, hybrid Z, or fun decent "period feel" determines what level a car can be brought back from. Making a monster track car does not require a low vin and perfect dash.

[MotoManMike]

Serious frame rail rust, upper strut mount rust or rot, strut rod mount rust. anything safety related, if its not solid you'll know, poke a screw driver in it.