26th-Z

Zowwie! No intention on my part to get into an argument, however a few of the facts are getting a little distorted and I am begining to believes that whats I thinks are facts might very well be my own opinion. With regard to what I paid for #27 and what I got...I was offered twice what I paid for the car the day after I bought it. Fact. I was flattered and the fellow who made me the offer is one of my closer Z friends. The parts that came with #27 were very nice indeed, but hardly worth $1,000. I have purchased similar parts for #26 - on eBay. No "anyone" cannot purchase HLS30-00040 for $5,500. It was sold within days of the advertisement. Deals get snapped up fast. It was gone with hours of my hearing about it. Another low VIN car that sold for a similar price to #40 needed floors. I recently saw a low VIN parts car go for $1,000. I have been watching early VIN car sales and Vintage Z car sales for quite some time. I have been competitively buying parts and restoring components from dashboards to engines for two years. I think I have a pretty good grip on the market. I stick to my guns on the values I have mentioned. You have, in my opinion, a very restorable and potentially valuable car, NovaSS. I'm surprised it hasn't been snatched up like white on rice. It has long been my opinion that one cannot fully understand the phenomenon of the 240-Z without understanding what happened in Japan. Your example has several unique qualities which gives it a high value potential. RESTORE THAT JAPANESE BEAUTY What do you gus think of the dancer look fenders? Zebra stripes!

Electrolytic rust removal is just fine for blocks, but if you just had it hot tanked, what rust? The reason you can't find anything on the internet about hydrogen embrittlement from the electrolytic process is because there is none. Hydrogen embrittlement comes from acid cleaning processes.

Here is where it gets interesting. The backing plate to the air cleaner "lower" is part number 16528-E4600. The one on the left is from 26. Notice the nice round air horns. The valve cover breather vent tube bends inside the cleaner. There are other vent tubes on the outside for the carburetor vent hoses. The crankcase breather vent is just a hole in the backing plate. The mystery air cleaner has none of this. Notice the air horns are nipped off. Notice the screen for the valve cover breather - no tube. Also, there are no vent tubes for the carburetor or a vapor recovery system hose. There ARE dimples in the metal to mark the locations of where these lugs would be welded on to the backing plate, but nothing is there and there are no signs of modification. The piece is real clean. In my parts book, the air cleaner assembly is superseded a number of times. 16500-E4600 is good to 8/71. Then E4700 to 6/72. Then E4701 from 7/72 to 7/73. There is optional 16500-E4610 introduced 8/71. There is also 16500-E8800 introduced 9/71 "L24 Tropics". What do you think I have?

Lets start with the "can" - the outer "upper" part that has the air horn. The left picture is the can from 26. Notice how the air filter is held in place by spring clips. The picture on the right has rounded tabs to hold the air filter in place. The mystery cleaner has this type. From my parts book, both of these types are 16526-E4300.

You all must know what an eBay junkie I am. Over the months, I have picked up two early style air cleaners. These are the types with an open air horn and no damper or preheater outlet. I want to show you three cleaners using the original from 26 as an example to describe the other two. The air cleaner can and backing plate on the left is original from 26. The one in the middle is a later style that incorporates a vent tube for the fuel vapor recovery system in the Z. 26 has no fuel vapor recovery system and that is a peculiar issue with very early cars. The air cleaner on the right is the mystery cleaner. I can't figure out where / what it came from. Perhaps it doesn't belong on a Z car. Who has seen one of these? Here are all three. Detailed explanation and pictures to follow.

Ok! I got my pictures of my alternators! These came off 26 and 27. I just had both of them restored. They were both frozen solid and the staters had to be rewound to have them function again. The front fan and pulley need to be plated - not painted black. The fans are in good enough shape to be plated, but both pulleys are pitted from rust and must be replaced. The Datsun patches are just there for photographic interest.

Y'all make me laugh. Thanks. A 1969 produced Fairlady - VIN 144 - in poor condition, not running, with floor and frame rail rust issues, requiring full restoration but quite salvageable is worth between $3,500 and $7,000 in the United States. It may be worth more on the East coast than the West coast, but it is only worth what someone is willing to pay and accept at any given time. Those numbers are close to what the last four double-digit VIN cars in comparable condition I have seen trade for. This Fairlady may very well start, but I am not under the impression that she is a driver. Princess 27 was a dead toad and I paid $2,350. Carl Beck, you’re dreaming! Nice condition drivable Fairladys have been selling in the high teens to low twenties over the last year-and-a-half. A buyer should expect to spend over $30,000 to restore the car to show condition and I will use the Vintage Z program quality as a guideline. Easily $30,000. The same car completed is worth $35,000 and up. If you all think I would part with my "common" low VIN cars after they are complete for anything less, you need to go home, close the doors and windows and have a good cry. The last few Vintage Zs have traded in the high $20s to low $30s. Chris

"Running when parked" You have a small fortune in junk parts. I would love to make a mold of the hubcap center.

Once again, our discussions have turned into the sharing of informative, factual accounting about our beloved in a world environment and not just the "relevant" market. Thanks. I am enjoying this chat. I think the point we are missing about the four speed transmission in the American market is that it didn't matter. The Datsun 240Z (HLS30U) didn't need a five speed transmission to BLOW off the competition - two time national champion in the first two years since introduction. Whether or not the American market was sophisticated enough to demand a five speed is irrelevant. The 240Z surpassed everything in its class and kept up with sports cars well outside it's class (read Corvette) perfectly without any perceived performance enhancement of a five speed - close ratio or not. In 1970, Americans were lucky to get a four speed. Most everything from Detriot that closely resembles the Datsun 240Z class came with three-speeds. The HLS30U / 240Z was so perfectly suited to the American market that it sold in droves propelling it to fame. If you think about it, a 432 Fairlady would have been dangerous. It is a GOOD thing that Americans got four speeds! All in the best of fun, Chris

A couple of comments: Fuel economy was a very large concern in America during the '70s. I'll point to the "Datsun Saves" add campaign. Americans waited in line to buy gasoline in 1973/4 and the president told us to turn off our Christmas lights in order to conserve oil. The national speed limit was reduced to 55mph. Scott / Vicky, I don't think I can voice my enthusiasm more!

I didn't realize you guys were into making molds and casting parts. Thought I was on to something new! Evidently not. What are you making, Will?

ZSaint, There is no "correct" order and of course you don't want to put things on that make it difficult to put other things on. Start with the fuel and brake lines / wiring harness. Once you get to the point of putting the suspension back in, the car should come off the rotisserie because of weight. I don't see why you can't put the gas tank in before you take the car off the rotisserie,

Funny you should bring up this subject. I just attended a seminar for mold making and casting. http://www.rubbermoldcompounds.com/

Yes it is! Carl, new speedometers were not provided. Speedometers were not reset to 0.

Thanks for the pictures, Kats. That is a black distributor cap. The picture in my 1969 brochure shows a black cap.

Oh, you don't know the half of it Will. Go get that car! Nova, you mentioned having the original hub caps. I would love to see them.

Good luck to all you guys bidding.

Dover, Delaware? Too much! 27 came from Dover, Delaware. Interesting interior pose. The seat folds forward? Notice the seatbelt hook on the passenger seat.

OH YES ! ! ! Pictures Please. Lots of pictures! Serious interest. Lets have a look at your car!

That is a great photo, Kats. My original brochure for 26 shows a black distributer cap and I have a conversation going about what color cap is early. The blue air cleaner is fabulous! I wonder what decals are on it? Thanks for your photo, Alan. That clears up another question, incidently. Thanks. The first picture is of the throttle linkage end from 26 and 27. The second picture shows four of the same linkage parts. The two on the left are early. The one in the middle with the curved end is a later version. Notice the one on right is upside-down. What is that?

Tom, #16 and #19 have the same heat shield as mine. Z Therapy shows the same one as mine. Could this be a Fairlady part? We are stumped. I am also stumped about an air cleaner I have. Pictures soon. Kats, Would you please look up a part number for me from your 1969 parts book? Distributer cap. My book shows 22162-E3001 but the cap is green with aluminum contacts. I want to know what the black with brass contacts cap is - or if it is different. For that matter, what is the deal between the green caps and the black caps?

I was happy to see other people having just as much fun at a Z convention!

I agree. For informational purposes, include in your post "copyright Nissan Motor Corporation".

I think we are on the same page, SuperDave. I assure you the professional guys are having fun and doing it for the grins they get from racing. And I guess I should clarify that a bit by excluding NASCAR from my observations. I don't really pay much attention to NASCAR. Its just not my cup of tea. I don't know if those guys are doing it for the fun, but I'll bet they are. None-the-less, I wanted to emphasize the competitive spirit associated with racing when I made my comment. I raced many years ago. I won some and I lost some. I had a blast. Racing sports cars is one of the top three "most fun things you can do with your clothes on". Now, I am spending $$$$ on restoring cars. The game is pretty much the same - without the speed thing.

Kats, I have a bunch of pictures to post of strange parts I cannot identify. Can we do this here? As soon as I get photos of the alternators, I will post them. Just after you bought yours, I found one in Jim's garage. Then I took the one off #27 and sent them both to a shop that specializes in antique electrical motors and such. Both of my alternators were frozen solid! Both of them had to be rewound and those parts were sent to two different places! The fellow kept calling me on the phone to explain the delay saying; "you can't get parts for these things anymore"! They were finished yesterday and I must go pick them up. I can't wait! Here are two heat shields. The one with the throttle spring clips on the bottom is from 26 and 27. Look at this one with the throttle spring clips in the middle. What is that from?