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VERY INTERESTING THREAD ABOUT PAINTING WITH A ROLLER.-Hybridz


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Yeah, looks pretty interesting. Read that on another forum as well. Looks to be close to the 70's burnt orange found on many 240z's as well. I'm sure you could find it in other colors.

There are two posibilities: First, this could be one hell of a find and could be a viable alternative to spray-gun painting a car OR Second, this could be something that wouldn't last very long and wouldn't provide much protection to the metal underneath.

Looks like a sweet idea though. Touch up would be a breeze too!

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Can't believe I read all 10 pages of those posts on the MoPar site, but it is interesting, especially if you are into DIY and don't have the facilities or skills to spray paint. I live just four miles from the Great White North too. Still would like to leave my paint to the professionals, but the thread definately got me thinking.

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When I first read this I immediately thought it was the 1st of April, now having digested it a little more I can see some advantages.

Spray painting gives a relatively thin coat of paint whilst any type of handpainting (roller or brush) would certainly have a thicker coat.

Surely this would be an advantage?

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Here's the text:

here's how i painted my car for about $50, it's actually very easy and the results are amazing. First off, get a can of tremclad real orange (or what ever color u want) in the can, not spray, yes tremclad, it is a acrylic/enamel paint which is very durable. next prep your car as if was any other paint job, fix all the rust, ect....no need to prime the car since the tremclad allready contains elements which allow it to be painted over bare metal. next, after prepping the car get a small 4" professional FOAM rollers, it's tiny and has one end rounded off, and the other cut straight, and is a very high density foam. u also need a jug of mineral spirits to thin the paint. The thing i really like about this is that there's no mess, no tapeing the whole car, just key areas, and u can do it in your garage, since your not spraying there is virtually no dust in the air, just clean your garage first, also it does'nt really smell at all, dries overnight and it super tough paint. also it you decide to paint the car professionally later, just prep and paint, there's no need to strip the tremclad. i have done this to a few cars, and i can say it works amazing, u just have to be paitient. next u thin the paint with mineral spirits so it just about as thin as water, a little thicker. get out the roller and paint away, don't get the paint shaked when u buy it, enamel is stirred, otherwise you'll have bubbles in the paint for a week!!! after u do 2 coats, wet sand the whole car, then repeat, 2 coats, wetsand, 2 coats wetsand. i painted the charger using a can since your not spraying the car u use all the paint and not spray 50% in the air, use progressivly finer sand paper each time. it's not really that much work, cause u can stop and start any time, u can do just a door, or the hood, ect. do one panel at a time, and don't stop once you start. once your done the final coat, wetsand with about 1000 grit to a totally smooth finish, and then using a high speed polisher i use a buffing bonnet and turtle wax polishing compound. do the whole car with this, and i'm telling u, depending on the amount of time and paitence you have, the results are amazing. laugh if you want, but for $50 ($30 for paint, about $20 for rollers, sand paper, ect...) it really looks good. also you can do these steps overnight, paint one evening and by morning u can wet sand. i have personally done alot of painting, mostly single stage acrylic enamel, and i've sprayed several cars in my garage with really good professional results, just it stinks, it's a real pain to do, easy to make a mistake, messy, and expensive. The tremclad is awesome paint, the "real orange" is an amazing hemi orange, and almost looks like it has some perl in the sun, awesome color right out of the can. I used this technique on my 1974 beetle also, here are the results:

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/Picture10.jpg

the car before:

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/IM000475.jpg

another after pic:

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/DSC00164.jpg

here is a car i sprayed (71 beetle, midnight blue metalic):

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/DSC00194.jpg

here is the car before (71 beetle):

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/Picture1.jpg

here's a few pics of the charger done:

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/DSC02764.jpg

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/DSC02769.jpg

well that's my 2 cents worth, sorry for the long post. i was borred LOL

i painted the orange beetle in 1999, and it still looks like the day i painted it, the 71 blue beetle i painted in 2000, and built the car for my dad, i used the same paint on my charger, maybe one day i'll spring for a good paint job, prepping is 90% of the work, stripping the car, sanding, ect.....painting is overrated!!!

So if you have TIME, then i'd say go for it, the worst that could happen is that it does'nt turn out and your out $50, but if your paitient, and expriement with lets say just the trunk pannel and if you like it do the whole car, if not just get it done by someone else for $4000. i don't know about you guys, but i would rather spend the $4000 on other parts like getting the mechanics sorted out and new chrome, cause when u have really nice paint and crappy bumpers, door handles it just sticks out more.

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I read the whole 10ish pages (phew). Had me sold till the guy who showed his results was able to scratch it back to bare metal. If it works I think it needs more clarification. Eg Exact branding to use, with what solvent, at what ratio.

But yeah, cheap way to get some colour on your car. I think I'd wait till lotsa people can vouch its success.

2c

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Yeah, I read the full 10 pages as well. It is yet unproven.

Hey Go240--would you be willing to schelp across the border and buy a gallon of Tremclad and ship it to me for some testing? I'll pay you in advance.

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Yeah, I read the full 10 pages as well. It is yet unproven.

Hey Go240--would you be willing to schelp across the border and buy a gallon of Tremclad and ship it to me for some testing? I'll pay you in advance.

That could probably be arranged. The next town is about 5 miles away and they have a couple of hardware stores. Might take a trip to Penticton, BC though to find a bigger home center big box type store, I know they have a Canadian Tire (sounds like a tire store, but actually is more of a Home Depot type store). Let me do some checking on the phone first, as it snowed again today. Thanks to Homeland Security it is also getting to be more of a hassle crossing the border nowadays. It used to be almost as easy as driving to the next town. Now they want Passports or Birth Certificates, even though that isn't really the law. And that's returning to the states, they're much nicer crossing into Canada (usually). In the old days, many of the customs/immigration guys on the U.S. side were my old High School teachers picking up a few bucks working nights or after they retired from teaching.

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It got my curiousity up too. I hope this thread can draw some interest. Personally, no way I can afford the cost of a "decent" paint job ($3-4K?), yet looking at my "tomato soup Red" paint job just bugs the :tapemouth out of me. Makes you wonder, someone brought up a good point; how were things (autos, metals, etc) painted before industrial spray painting were common? I've seen any number of metal antiques with brilliant paintwork, and industrial auto spray painting wasn't commonplace until the 1930's or even '40s (?). True, it might be more time/labor intensive than having someone spray the car for me, but if the article holds true, most of the paint work can be done in stages. That kind of time I've got - paint a couple of coats one weekend, wetsand the next weekend, etc., etc., until it's ready for a final buffing.

I'm definitely going to keep an eye on the original thread to see if it continues to thrive. It does sound too good to be true, but the older I get the more I realize that great ideas are NOT always accepted easily - for many reasons (usually money, unfortunately). I'm even contemplating a little experimenting, I've got an old Sears riding mower that could use a coat of paint, it might be the perfect test bed: it sits outside 365, gets routinely blasted with dust, dirt and stones, and if it ends up looking bad - WHO CARES!!! :cheeky:

Addendum: the photo links in the original article/blog dont seem to work, but if you search directly for "69Martin" at Photobucket you can get to them. Here's the link to his photo collection relevant to the thread:

http://photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/paint/

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I have a can of this in the shed along with the mineral spirits and sand paper. I might try it on the parts car first (in a small amount) to get an idea of how this really works. I have used rustoleum to paint a couple of things but always used the spray gun to do it. Will keep this thread updated on an out come.

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I'm going to subscribe to this thread, as I'd like to see the outcome if someone tries it.

I don't have any one of the cars ready for paint so it would be a while before I could test / report on it. I would, however, be interested in hearing other's experience with it.

This reminds me of the way I used to watch Taxicabs get painted in Mexico City, by their owner/ operators. The key to this type of work / results are your own diligence in exacting work, and lots of it. Another form of craftsmanship.

s it plausible/possible ? Absolutely. Feasible? Depends on how much time and most importantly, energy you have. If you work on the car, one section at a time and keep track of where / what you've done you can definitely achieve great results. But it all depends on how much skill and determination you have.

Wet sanding a car isn't just stroking the paint with a particle impregnated piece of paper, it's careful and methodical scupting of the bodylines. Plane carve a curved fender and you "scalp" the paint, avoiding a bend and you fill it in. All of these tend to "dull" the bodylines of the car. If you are good enough to do a good job of wetsanding, then you CAN achieve beautiful results with this method. Speaking as someone who's wet-sanded a lot of cars, it isn't just a couple-hour job. If you haven't done it in a while....it can get VERY tiring.

But you next need to look at your palette of colors.

The type of paint that would work really well with this technique is a monochromatic enamel. You would need to ensure that the paint used is homogeneous, i.e. all the same, as opposed to comprised of individual components as in the Metallics.

The subtle shading effects possible with a metallic will have a positively different sheen and "texture" (the "lay" of the metallic particles) being rolled on than sprayed. That's just simply the nature of the beast, it's the suspension of metallic particles in a translucent environment. It might prove to have a decidedly different and surprising effect.

The colors available are also going to make it an interesting result.

But, there is absolutely nothing wrong with that technique.

E

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My question is even if the paint is 'self leveling' how do you not get the paint to run down when you are painting the sides of the car? Unless you are just very careful to apply the minimum amount of paint, sand, paint, sand, paint and the paint thickness builds up...I may have just answered my own question...damn!

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If you read the article on Hybridz, then you would see that someone has already done it and is also trying it on a larger piece as well to see just how well it works.

With only a few coats it looks pretty good and shines really well. Definetly a good deal for some of the people that dont have the money to afford 3000 dollar and up paint jobs.

So that not proven theory is wrong it DOES work!

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My brother is an auto body painter. I am learning more everyday from him but there is something that doesn't look right about that paint. Sure it is is glossy but that isn't all that makes a good paint job. Plus the paint doesn't seem to have much depth, i would have to see it in person to be conviced of its validity. Also, you are very limited with this paint. Look at new cars almost every new car isn't plain color, they have metallic or pearl. The best colors have either metalic or pearl or both. Anyways, for $3-4 you will be lucky to get a paint job that is any good. YOu may as well risk the $50. My brother just finished a 67 Mustang, Dark metalic with ghost racing stripes and a $25,000 price tag. How good was the job, $25,000. The guy that helped my brother paints hot rods and has had one featured in a magazine. He gave the job a 9 out of ten. This was before the car was wet sanded and rubbed. No way in hell I would do this but if my brother wasn't a painter, i would spend $50 before $3000

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  • 2 weeks later...

I am a hybridz member and have been keeping up on the several threads about this stuff and have tried it a little bit on my flat black Z...You have to get it pretty thin to roll on correctly. It is suprisingly durable on the section I took down to bare metal but the part that was painted over the layers of blue and black paint from the years is not as durable. I haven't gotten it to the proper consistancy because I just haven't had time to work on my z at all. I think for a Z that doesn't need a $2k or more paint job this is the perfect solution. I am experimenting with black right now and I will post some pictures of my overly-thick and pressed too hard painted sections...not too bad for a first time and vague consistancy refrences..."until it just feels right"...I think the hybridz guys have done a better job at testing this paint theory than those pushrod guys...

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I am a hybridz member and have been keeping up on the several threads about this stuff and have tried it a little bit on my flat black Z...You have to get it pretty thin to roll on correctly. It is suprisingly durable on the section I took down to bare metal but the part that was painted over the layers of blue and black paint from the years is not as durable. I haven't gotten it to the proper consistancy because I just haven't had time to work on my z at all. I think for a Z that doesn't need a $2k or more paint job this is the perfect solution. I am experimenting with black right now and I will post some pictures of my overly-thick and pressed too hard painted sections...not too bad for a first time and vague consistancy refrences..."until it just feels right"...I think the hybridz guys have done a better job at testing this paint theory than those pushrod guys...

Any photos to update us with? I picked up some of the paint today and will start experimenting with it either tomorrow or next weekend.

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Definetlly interesting... but there is no way that after the years I spent just looking for the perfect Z for me, that I would even remotely think about painting her with anything other than an appropriate automotive finish. Just my opinion. Although, I do applaud and admire anyone who takes this approach and has a good turn out. Also, I took a look at the rustoleom site and found a high performance paint in the Industrial side of the site that said it was an acrylic enamel, which is what the fellow said the Tremclad was.

Here it is http://www.rustoleum.com/product.asp?frm_product_id=91&SBL=2

Nate

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Project "Beer Fridge" notes:

(Project "Beer Fridge" is an unabashed, untainted and totally foolhardy attempt to see if this painting technique will work for one woefully underfunded, underskilled but enthusiastic artisan - myself! The goal: repaint the garage refridgerator - refererred lovingly as simple "Beer Fridge" with an sexy coat of Sunrise Red Gloss, and if all goes as planned an even sexier set of white racing stripes using the technique described in this thread... oooooh, can't you just see it now!)

1. Project gets underway today. Cleaned the fridge well, wiped down with mineral spirits and let dry.

2. Wetsanded with 400 grit paper to give the paint something to grip.

3. Wiped down again with mineral spirits again and let dry well.

4. Mix Paint: It's a warm Florida day (~80 degrees, but dry by S. FL standards) so I mix the paint with ~10% mineral sprits. Seems pretty darn thin to me.

5. Of note, although the fridge is clean, there are a significant number of surface rust spots, most noticably on the top from condensation when opening the freezer. Beer Fridge has been living a very comfortable life in the garage for several years now, but as it is S. Florida, it does get VERY humid in here. I chose not to sand down the rust spots to clean metal because A. I'm lazy and excited to get going, and B. because I wanted to see just how the Rustoleum would handle these spots.

6. Main Door - Okay, here we go... BUBBLES! More bubbles, and more bubbles. :(

They are not going away, not after a light pressure re-roll either. A good stiff blast of breath pops them and the paint starts to lay down. Whew! Half way thru the door and I'm beginning to think the paint is too thick - or is it my technique? I press on.

7. Top door - trying to work a little faster and the results are better. Loading up more paint on the roller and trying NOT to reroll so much (causing in effect a second coat). This is where I realize I'm starting to make a mess of things, not with the rolling but with my brush technique. Cut-in is not my strong suit and it shows grossly here. Drips and sags from too much paint, then I remember 69Chargers advice; roller in one hand, brush in the other. Getting better... you are wise, oh Master 69Charger.

8. Left Side - Load roller more, roll faster. Hmmm, this is starting to work better. Still have lots of bubbles but by now I'm huffing and puffing away to get them all popped, and the results are starting to look much better! Note to self: quit smoking cigarettes... SOON!

9. Top surface - MUCH easier to do a horizontal surface! Even with te considerable rust up here, I can see much better results.

10. Left side - Ironically, this side comes out best. Ironic because "Beer Fridge" sits up next to the water heater and there's no manuevering room on this side. Because of this, I take the tact of REALLY loading up the roller and working very fast. Get as much on as I can and get it spread out as quickly as I can. Huff, puff, and the paint really statrs to lay down nicely. Lesson learned? By going quicker I'm not "pulling" the paint up with the roller as much.

First coat done, time to assess: Time for my "WTF AM I DOING!" moment! Standing back, the fridge looks... Horrible. Verging on frightening. BUT... It admitedly did a rather nasty job on the first door, and looking at the final side, things look much better. Wait an hour and re-assess.

Okay, it STILL looks bad but I'm ready to press on. I SHOULD really stop here and sand down what I've done, but I decide to press on.

11. Mix Paint for coat #2 - I basically doubled the mineral spirits to ~20-25% this time. MUCH thinner, really starts to feel like water this time around. Yes Master, Grasshopper is learning.

12. Second Coat - what a world of difference! Still getting the bubbling but only for a few quick seconds. Even the slightest breath disperses them and the paint really lays down quick and smooth. If not, a very light pressure re-roll and slight puff is all it takes.

13. Entire surface takes half as much time as coat #1 and the results are much better.

Clean up and done for the night.

Evaluation: learned quite a bit. First and foremost; THIN THAT FRIGGIN PAINT! Even while mixing batch number two I thought to myself "this will never work, it's too damned thin..." WRONG! I can definitely see that coat number one was too thick, and that it will take at least 3-4 coats using the thinner batch to completely cover the underlaying color (white), but the benefit is that the thinner coat goes on MUCH smoother with less trouble. Less trouble, and less sanding, which is what I will be doing ALOT of after that first coat mess I made. But I had the wife give me an honest opinion, and looking at the final LEFT side with two coats - unsanded - even she saw the potential.

Gonna take some photos but hold off posting them until I get a chance to wetsand first (don't want to scare off anyone just yet).

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