20 hours ago, HS30-H said:

Let's take a look at the random example of a bolt from the front suspension. It's one of the hex bolts that holds the balljoint onto the transverse link.

Part number from the 1970 Nissan C-187 Parts Catalog for the S30 and PS30 models is: 81-30820-65 BOLT WITH WASHER.

Nissan Engineering Standard (NES) tables, the '81' prefix identifies it as a Hex bolt and the '65' suffix - when you look it up on the above table - shows us that it is Galvanized/Zinc Plated.

So far it appears that cadmium was NOT banned in Japan in 1970. Therefore it is possible that cadmium plated hardware was available in the automotive industry in 1970 and early 1971. Carl Back has evidence apparently obtained from a very reputable high level technology company, Honeywell, that cadmium was present on the hardware he had tested from 240Z's. It's not clear how much. Maybe a plating bath was contaminated and there was just a trace.

Mistakes happen, and sometimes deception. There are easily imagined scenarios where cadmium plated hardware could make it on to a 240Z production line, especially since cadmium was not banned and was still used in "more than 1,000 Japanese plants" in early 1971 .

At this point the argument is between what Nissan's documents say, and what Carl Beck observed, and what general public documentation from the time period describes. That's the whole thing in a single sentence. All that I've done is add a little bit of clarity. Forum members can draw their own conclusions.

The main point, Carl Beck's public service announcement, in a way, might actually be for people working with early 240Z hardware to assume that it might contain cadmium and to take appropriate precautions. Especially since the aftermarket appears to be offering cadmium plated hardware. Maybe Carl got some aftermarket bolts? Who knows.

https://www.zeddsaver.com/pages/about-us

https://www.nemetalworks.com/cadmium-plating-services

1 hour ago, HS30-H said:

Nissan Engineering Standard (NES) tables, the '81' prefix identifies it as a Hex bolt and the '65' suffix - when you look it up on the above table - shows us that it is Galvanized/Zinc Plated.

And therein lies the problem Galvanizing and Zinc plating are two totally different processes, the only thing they have in common is Zinc. If the Japanese specification is this vague then there will always be some confusion to what type of coating was used on the parts.

Coming back to the Vintage Z restoration program of 1996-98 in the USA; Nissan Motor Corporation USA was very specific that Cad plating be used and listed it repeatedly in their "Quality Control Checklist". They also listed suspension parts be painted semi-gloss black not powder coated. There is no confusion here, it's all in black and white on the document.

58 minutes ago, SpeedRoo said:

And therein lies the problem Galvanizing and Zinc plating are two totally different processes, the only thing they have in common is Zinc. If the Japanese specification is this vague then there will always be some confusion to what type of coating was used on the parts.

Vague? The Nissan literature - I've put it in front of you many times on this thread - reads ' 亜鉛メッキ ' (Aen Mekki). That translates fairly literally as 'Zinc plating', but many people will take that a step further and translate it as 'Galvanizing' (English spelling 'Galvanising', with an s). Black Zinc is also on the list.

So we have an old-Japanese Kanji word for an element ( 亜鉛 ) sitting next to a modern Japanese version of an English technical process term ( メッキ ) written out in phonetic Japanese, Katakana. There's nuance involved which may well sail over heads who are not used to Japanese-English-Japanese translation, but the bottom line is that we are talking about a protective coating of Zinc, applied via electroplating ('Mekki'). You might be interested to hear that the original usage of the term 'Mekki' in Japan was in connection with Gilding.

Yes, it's not strictly the true Galvanizing process (more suited to water tanks and shed roofs) but there's the nuance... People who insist on 100% literal terminology might be well advised to steer away from ideogram-based languages and their writing systems, for there be dragons.

You might notice - although it's hard to tell given your "therein lies the problem" - that no Cadmium is mentioned.

1 hour ago, SpeedRoo said:

Coming back to the Vintage Z restoration program of 1996-98 in the USA; Nissan Motor Corporation USA was very specific that Cad plating be used and listed it repeatedly in their "Quality Control Checklist".

Yes, noted. Although I have a hunch that we might be going to hear a little more about that soon. Stay tuned.

Did Nissan ever use cadmium plating? Was it in use and they switched or did they start with zinc?

Quite the discussion. You all seem to be describing an element metal by its color. Cadmium is silver. It's the chromate additive that makes the color and you can't tell the difference between the cadmium chromate and the zinc chromate. There are ASTM and SAE specifications for plating in these materials. Yes, you can have cadmium chromate plating but how does this all matter?

So, I wrote a brief forward and printed five copies of the original 2005 script. They are about 35-40 single sided pages, color pictures, spiral bound with a cover page. It cost me about $15 each to make this nice. I really need to keep one, two are spoken for right now so I have two and I can always print more. Let me know.

Please, please be most careful when suggesting ANYTHING from zeddsaver. I, and a number of folks I spoke with over the years , had problems, some big/significant.

50 minutes ago, 26th-Z said:

You all seem to be describing an element metal by its color.

I am only talking about the element cadmium, 48 on the periodic chart, and its use in plating metal parts for corrosion protection.

Carl Beck suggested that early 240Z parts were plated with cadmium, HS30-H disagrees. Carl Beck says that he had some parts analyzed scientifically, at Honeywell.

It's been a long discussion, not one that can be absorbed fully without reading most of the last three to four pages of posts.

https://www.anoplate.com/news-and-events/what-is-cadmium-plating/

https://periodic-table.rsc.org/element/48/cadmium

24 minutes ago, zspert said:

Please, please be most careful when suggesting ANYTHING from zeddsaver. I, and a number of folks I spoke with over the years , had problems, some big/significant.

The point was that cadmium is still being used to plate parts for old cars. Zeddsaver is just an example.

3 hours ago, Zed Head said:

Did Nissan ever use cadmium plating? Was it in use and they switched or did they start with zinc?

Apparently they made a special 240Z for Carl Beck with Cadmium-plated parts. ;-)

To be serious - just for a moment - your question is very wide in scope. Nissan have been active since the 1930s in numerous sectors of the automotive field, including war materiel, so it seems very likely that they and/or one of their numerous suppliers will have used Cadmium plating at some point. But we are only looking at the S30-series Z range here, so - as far as I am aware from looking at period documentation - no Cadmium was used when 'our' cars were made.

2 hours ago, 26th-Z said:

You all seem to be describing an element metal by its color. Cadmium is silver. It's the chromate additive that makes the color and you can't tell the difference between the cadmium chromate and the zinc chromate.

Can't speak for anyone else, but I'm not. I understand the difference.

2 hours ago, 26th-Z said:

There are ASTM and SAE specifications for plating in these materials.

Not to mention JIS, JSAE and NES. Japanese industry standards are somewhat germane to the discussion, I'd say.

2 hours ago, 26th-Z said:

Yes, you can have cadmium chromate plating but how does this all matter?

Et tu, Brute?

OF COURSE it matters. Getting your hose clamps oriented to the same way they did when the car left the production line is a matter of life and death for some of us. And those rivets don't count themselves you know. If WE don't do it, who will?

48 minutes ago, HS30-H said:

Et tu, Brute?

OF COURSE it matters. Getting your hose clamps oriented to the same way they did when the car left the production line is a matter of life and death for some of us. And those rivets don't count themselves you know. If WE don't do it, who will?

I'm not about to wade into this discussion except to say that I think there's a lot to be said for the quoted comments. First, I like, and get in this context, the Shakespeare reference. Ouch! I'm betting it was a weak moment for 26th and he'll be back onside soon. But more importantly, if there's a community on the internet more dedicated to knowing everything there is to know about Datsun Z Cars, I haven't found it. This is it. Sometimes it takes a long, rancorous discussion to get to the answer, but down the road it's only the answer that will matter. Good for you guys for caring enough about this stuff to challenge each other to get to the right answers. Not everyone will care about whether it was cadmium chromate or zinc chromate, but a few will, and we stand a better chance of determining the answer today than we ever will in the future.

Cheers to you guys for your dedication to the cause!

Taking sides doesn't lead to learning. Independent thought does. HS30-H might be trying to influence 26th-Z, or just expressing surprise.

After roaming the electronic wasteland I finally decided to see what one of the AI models would generate, even though I really hate how you can't do a simple Google search today without AI butting in with an opinion. Supposedly they collect all of the available data on the WWW and distill it down to its essence. BS of course since processed garbage is still garbage. But it did come up with an interesting comment. In this case the absence of evidence is actually telling. The great AI large language scavenger found nothing. But, of course, I also found evidence of a ban, showing the weakness of today's "AI". In 2007, last link below.

https://www.google.com/search?q=when+was+cadmium+banned+in+japan

JAMA document with an interesting note.

https://www.jama.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/The-Motor-Industry-of-Japan-2014.pdf