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I just cant get windshield on, please advice

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I tried to install my 240Z's windshield for 5 hours straight and it didnt fit. We used the rope as instructed in manual. Upper part of the windshield weatherstrip fits ok but when we get to lower part, glass is almost 1cm off from metal. Window fits right without weatherstrip

I suspect that reason for this is aftermarket weatherstrip, i just recently bought them and while installing hatch glass i noticed that something was not right. The chrome moulding installation was a hard one! And those mouldings literally sink inside the strip, and as i compared some pieces of old hatch strip, its different. In old one chrome is more visible.

But please help, will i try to install this glass with this strip or should i try to order proper one.. i dont know what to do as i need to get car up and running in next 4 months.

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I see that you are from austrailia, you have to turn the car upside down then start from the top.

yes, bad jokes. Shouldn't you start along the bottom first then work your way around to the top?

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Well im quite far away from Aussie, in Finland. But thanks for the laugh :)

We tried firstly from the bottom but then the upper part was too far from metal.. Then we tried from up to down and no succes. It is like the weatherstrip is too big or something, it just wont fit without violence and i dont want to break that glass.

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Darrel man! LOL that was funny.

KOalia I try to do it also, it was easy to take the old one out but it was hard to put it on, I end up taking it to a glass shop and charge me 30.00 they also have that special tool to put the molding. To me was worth it.

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The trim molding gets put on the rubber BEFORE the windshield/rubber gets installed on the car.

It may seem counter-intuitive, but you'll literally shred the rubber trying to put the metal pieces in AFTER you've installed it. There are several threads with just that problem looking for a remedy... there isn't, you install the trim onto the rubber BEFORE you install the windshield.

The tool mentioned works... for the rubber or plastic insert commonly used on the EXPANSION style glass weatherstrip. That insert is used to push out the sides of the rubber AND lock in the glass. The metal trim on the Z, while it does have a small amount of "lock" to it, is mostly for a) looks and B) to push the outermost edge to seat on the body.

Referencing the tool again, it works by pushing the rubber out and away from the channel that the trim fits into and expects the trim to have a certain amount of "bend" to it. The Z's trim does NOT have any bend to it. You will leave small gouges and dents all the way around if you are not very VERY careful and very experienced.

Part of the "rope trick" is that as you install the windshield, your buddy on the outside should be pressing on the windshield both INTO the vehicle AND towards the edge of the windshield (upper or lower) that is opposite your starting point for the rope. That is, as you begin pulling on the rope from the lower portion of the windshield gasket, your buddy will be pushing from the top edge DOWN towards the lower edge, to keep the already inserted edge located firmly within the gasket's channel.

As you progress to the sides and round the corner(s), you will feel a gentle seating effect, keep working towards the last edge, when you round the last two corners, you will literaly feel the windshield drop into poistion. Finish the last of the edge and go around and with a teflon knife lift and smooth any imperfections in the gasket.

The bunching up of the gasket you are mentioning, causes me to wonder if you are pulling on the rope at 90° or less to the edge you are seating. More than 90° (i.e. essentially making the rope have a U bend) will cause the gasket to stretch as it seats and will leave you with excess material.

Another item, are you trying to do this with the dash IN or OUT of the car? With the dash in, you'll have a harder time pulling the rope out from the gasket's lip.

However, the suggestion to pay a pro to install it for you may be the easiest way to go.

FWIW

E

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Well im quite far away from Aussie, in Finland. But thanks for the laugh :)

We tried firstly from the bottom but then the upper part was too far from metal.. Then we tried from up to down and no succes. It is like the weatherstrip is too big or something, it just wont fit without violence and i dont want to break that glass.

Well, that takes care of having to flip the car upside down. :stupid:

To go along with escanlon's post, get the gasket warm, and use lots of soapy water.

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You may need a hook tool to finish seating the gasket as your buddy pushes down. Make sure to remove the metal trim piece at the front edge of the dash with the 6 or so screws or it may not seat at the bottom. Best to start at the bottom and pull the rope 6" on one side at a time than the other side. Be careful at the corners.

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We did mine in the yard in about 15 minutes with a gasket from Black Dragon. Had the gasket nice and warm, used windex to lube the gasket well, used a thin nylon rope pulling from center bottom each direction. One guy inside pulling rope, one guy outside appling pressure. Also put the metal trim in when all done with no special tools and no problems. Adjusted the corners of the gasket by pushing gently with a blunt tool. Didn't use a drop of urethane and not a leak to be had. Maybe I was lucky?

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I havent tried to install mouldings yet to windshield, it was hard enough to install them on hatch glass. I have dash in but the metal plate is off. My wife was sitting ON the windshield as applying pressure ( and giving me nice view) but still it didnt fit. We get it 90% on place from below and after she rise from the windshield, low section just popped out. Maybe im just plain stupid on this :stupid:

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I havent tried to install mouldings yet to windshield, it was hard enough to install them on hatch glass. I have dash in but the metal plate is off. My wife was sitting ON the windshield as applying pressure ( and giving me nice view) but still it didnt fit. We get it 90% on place from below and after she rise from the windshield, low section just popped out. Maybe im just plain stupid on this :stupid:

ok, now this has to rate the "this thread is useless without pics" smiley.

Sounds like it's time to call in the professionals.

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We did mine in the yard in about 15 minutes with a gasket from Black Dragon. Had the gasket nice and warm, used windex to lube the gasket well, used a thin nylon rope pulling from center bottom each direction. One guy inside pulling rope, one guy outside appling pressure. Also put the metal trim in when all done with no special tools and no problems. Adjusted the corners of the gasket by pushing gently with a blunt tool. Didn't use a drop of urethane and not a leak to be had. Maybe I was lucky?

I think you and I represent the less touted point of view, as far as installing the stainless strips after the windshield is in. I have explained my methods before and here it is again. This is how Nissan originally did it and has outlined in the FSM.

To me, it makes absolutely no sense to assemble the trim strip into the rubber weatherstrip before installing the glass. It only serves to add ridgity to the weatherstrip and is detrimental to the needed flexibility of the rubber. When it comes to stresses put on the glass during installation, why would you want to increase the likelihood of breaking the glass by restricting the free movement of the rubber?

The methods used are of course an individual choice and it bothers me to no end when someone presents the method that worked for them as the only correct way to do this, or labels an alternate method as being wrong.

This is just a personal observation, but to me the Nissan weatherstrip is a higher quality part that is easier to work with and garners a better end result that is clearly noticeable. Not to say that the Precision windshield gasket is all that bad or shouldn't be used. Just my preference.

A few tips for a successful installation:

The rope/cord used is important. A 1/4" cotton cord is the best type to use. It has a "grip" characteristic that is beneficial when it is pulled out while seating the rubber over the flange. I don't mean the grip with your hands, but the grip it has on the rubber, pulling it over the flange. A nylon rope is not as good for this purpose. Most start with the rope wound into the groove starting and finishing at the top but there is something to be said about some installers who prefer to reverse this to take advantage of gravity. Their view is, by starting at the bottom, the weight of the glass assembly helps to seat itself making it easier to finish when reaching the top. Again, personal preference.

The single most important thing in my opinion, which has been mentioned by several already, is getting the rubber heated up enough to make it very pliable. It has to be heated thoroughly and sufficiently to retain enough flexibility to complete the entire installation. It's very important to get the windshield assembly seated on the flange, sealed and the trim strips installed all in one quick session, before the rubber has a chance to cool. It will cool somewhat just by the application of the lubricant used to facilitate the installation. Prior to installation, well positioned heat lamps are widely used for this today. In the past steam heated hot boxes were used in assembly plants.

The best lubrication that I have used is Isopar. It is a solvent that has several characteristics that are useful for doing this job. It makes the rubber slippery as anything, doesn't have any adverse effect on paint, vinyl, skin etc. and cleans off easily. When seating the glass and installing the stainless trim, the combination of hot flexible rubber, a good lubricant and the proper tools will make the installation so much more manageable, even for a novice.

In the pic, the tools I use are shown. The one that is of particular interest and the one that allows easy installation of the trim strip is in fact homemade. It was made to replace another made by Miller tools that I had for years. It is fashioned from a paint can opener and it works well. I wish I had a pic depicting its use but the best I can do is for now is describe it.

It is inserted over the end of the trim strip and into the groove of the rubber so it is holding the "lips" open. Without putting any pressure or even touching it, the stainless strip is simply laid into the channel as the tool is drawn around the periphery, joinig the pieces as you go.

I agree that if you are not comfortable doing this job or are worried about the glass breaking, a professional installer may be your best option. Most do make housecalls too. Good luck!

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...snip...The methods used are of course an individual choice and it bothers me to no end when someone presents the method that worked for them as the only correct way to do this, or labels an alternate method as being wrong.

But it's OK when YOU do so?

To me, it makes absolutely no sense to assemble the trim strip into the rubber weatherstrip before installing the glass.

==========

...snip... I have explained my methods before and here it is again. This is how Nissan originally did it and has outlined in the FSM.

The FSM's explanation of the process is quite simply:

"8. Install the windshield moulding."

Your added explanation, while it IS helpful, is not part of the FSM. You should note that your post implies that it is.

A less experienced person may not have the same level of success you have had with your method.

Additionally, while you've described your homemade tool, you've not given measurements nor a complete enough description so that someone can accurately replicate it. Do post some pictures, some measurements and the method of manufacture, or offer to sell one, but descriptions alone aren't a substitute.

In 1987 I contacted a glass installer to replace a windshield on a Z I was working on. That glass installer, who both showed and explained the reason for instaling the trim before mounting, was also on contract by the Nissan dealership in East Tawas Michigan and other Nissan dealerships in the area to replace glass in their bodyshops. His reasoning is/was simple, it's one less - tricky- step to do, and since you are pulling on the rope from the inside, does not change the characteristic of the gasket. I have used his method several times since then all with success, and so have others to whom I've described it to.

The gasket edge that holds the trim in place is very fragile and prone to tearing. Even Wick Humble in his book advises to be extremely careful with that edge.

So, while you have had success, others may not be as successful. So, while you may disagree with "my" method, there have been several people, myself included, who have had success with it.

Before you present your method as "the only correct way to do this", you just might want to find out if others haven't found it to be more difficult or problematic than it need be.

That's one of the many reasons for this site, to find workarounds, short-cuts and alternative methods to obscure instructions in the FSM. Otherwise we could save a lot of bandwidth by just posting.... "See the FSM".

My 2¢

E

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Enrique my friend, there is much you do not understand about this process and the impression I am getting is your mind is closed to anything that does not fit into the preconceived ideas that you have. My post stands as is. If you would like me to elaborate on the logic behind my methods, I will, but please, do me the courtesy of not quoting me out of context, in a feeble attempt to discredit my post. I believe that my statements were quantified as being an alternative method with logical benefits, which I briefly explained. I really can’t consider what others find easier unless it is also done properly.

Logic:

I know that it comes as no surprise to you that the windshield is a crucial part of the vehicle’s structure. Even as far back as 40 years ago, substantial research and development data had been accumulated and put into use, in the engineering and building of these cars.

It may seem unimportant or trivial to you but by installing the stainless trim strips before the assembly is seated correctly on the flange you are actually compromising the structural integrity of the car as designed.

If the trim strip is installed before the assembly is properly seated, how is it then possible to “apply adhesive to the entire periphery”, as instructed in the FSM? When built, you can bet this was a production process etched in stone, which was followed to the letter at Nissan. The adhesive has to be applied when the windshield assembly is centered in its relaxed, final installed position. “Adhesive” is a descriptive word in itself, which gives us a hint of its purpose. It is not described as sealant, although it did perform double duty to an extent. You would find it very interesting to see the “process control” sheets that are used and have been for as long as I can remember which cover every assembly process. A great deal of expense is incurred to develop the proper methods used. A lot of money was also invested to drum these preconceived ideas into my head and I’m just passing it on to you for free.

I really am not the least bit surprised what you tell me about the guy installing windshields for the Nissan dealership. I just feel sorry for the customers who never knew any better and believed his retoric.

The tool is really very simple and I actually believe it is not even needed. The picture is self explanatory. It is just slightly wider than the stainless strips, holds the “lips” in an open position and allows the trim to fall into place. The tool doesn’t come into contact with the bright surface at all. If the rubber has been sufficiently heated and lubricated, it can be installed easy enough with only a blunt fiber stick. The corners of the trim are the most difficult to finesse but still only as difficult as the flexibility of the rubber makes it.

As I started this post, referring to you as “my friend”, I truly do mean that and do also respect what you have to say, but in this case I am only trying to relay what I know and in the process hopefully prevent a broken windshield. You or anyone else can take it for what you think it is worth.

PS-We both put our pants on one leg at a time but I don't pull my zipper up until they are on and everything is positioned correctly.LOL

Sorry buddy, couldn't help myself.:D

Edited by geezer
added friendly jab

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KOALA as in Koala bear

Yes i know, but there is story behind my nick wich i wont tell :)

What comes to windshield, i decieded not to install it but rather rely on professionals. I'd rather pay a bit than lose my nerves and break the whole thing

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I've been installing autoglass for 18+ years and here's what I know. Step #1 do this in a warm environment, not outside in driveway on a cold day! Step #2 set windshield on sturdy folding rack outside facing up. #3 install the gasket to the windshield starting at the two top corners so the gasket is installed evenly around the glass. #4 spray the rubber with a soap/water solution. #5 Now, start installing the stainless trim, I use a small regular screwdriver for the corners and the fiber stick for the rest. The corners are done last and yes, they can be a pain. Since it isn't installed in the car yet, you can grab the rubber and spread it apart easier as you work the trim into the groove. If the glass is in the car and settled in the pincweld you get no more flex causing the installation of the trim to be far more difficult, but not impossible. #6 Now that the trim is in the rubber, carefully flip the glass over on the stand and install the rope in the groove of the gasket with both ends meeting at the bottom center and overlapping each other about six inches and tape the excess rope to the inside of windshield. Cheap standard clothesline rope works best. #7 this step is up to you and here's why. Modern vehicle windshields are installed with urethane for structual reasons, but more importantly because of the airbags. The windshield is what keeps the airbags IN the car. If you had an airbag in a 71 240z and it deployed, The force from you hitting the bag would pop the windshield right out, glued in or not, the rubber gasket is the weak link. Any sealant or adhesive used in the rubber gaskets of the older cars was for sealing purposes only. If you choose to use a sealant you can use a product called "3m windo-weld sealer". or I just use my urethane. You want to lay about a 1/4" bead to the inner/ lower/ inside edge of the pinchweld, does that make sense? #8 now, soak the pincweld and the gasket with soapy water and lay the glass in the opening evenly. #9 put on some disposable rubber gloves and start pulling the rope. If you do this just right you will only pull a little of the glue through with the rope, sometimes none, and clean up will be fairly easy, or not. In my opinion, if you have a rust free clean pinchweld and a NEW rubber gasket, don't worry about using a sealant. However, NEVER EVER use silicone to seal anything on a car body. Silicone is corrosive and will eventually cause serious rust issues. This isn't meant to be a step by step instructional on glass installation. This is just basically how I would approach this particular windshield. I'm not taking sides here either.

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Not yet, i called to windshield shop and they said that "just use that rope" and i said that yes but can you come here to install my windshield "-you can do it yourself" they say. Gee thanks a lot, i was willing to pay for them but if they dont want money, ok. :D That guy also said that start from the bottom of the glass.. im confused :) As a sealant i use Würth black seal/glue, very messy. I think i'll have to sacrifice next saturday to this.

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LOL! Well i guess sometimes the most simple tasks are the most difficult. I just installed hatch inner weatherstrip (original) and it was SO easy to install compared to aftermarket.

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Part 1 (I will do this post in several parts because of pics)

I would like to preface this install by saying this is what worked for me. I used the summary by 'rubrbulits' as my step by step guide, but ended up making alterations. I installed a PPG windshield using new Black Dragon Rubber that was made in Thailand :ermm:. The rubber was very pliable and fit to the glass well.

I started off with the rear hatch glass, because I felt that would be good to practice on. I put the rubber around the glass and put in the metal trim except for the corners. I figured I would put those on after the install. Everything fit well at this point. I then inserted the cord into the groove, all the way around. I overlapped the ends by about six inches. I taped the ends to the inside of the glass.

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Next, I put the sealant in the hatch groove as shown in the pics.I then made a tub of warm soapy water (dish soap) and soaked the rubber and glass edge with a rag. I then placed the soaped window and rubber onto the hatch.

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This is where things got tricky. I undid the rope on the inside and started pulling it along so that the inner lip would move over the pinchweld. This part on the inside was easy. The problem was getting the outside flap out of the groove and onto the flat portion of the hatch. The rubber flap wanted to fold over and stay in the groove where the sealant was. I had to try and lift it out of there and get it to lay flat on the flat portion of the hatch (hopefully that makes sense). Anyway, This did not work well. I would get 6" done, then lose 2"; 2" done then lose 5". After a frustrating 15 minutes of getting nowhere, I took out the metal trim.

With the trim out, things were way easier. I slid my thumb along the top edge to get the flap onto the body while pulling the string underneath. ( I could not do this with the trim in because it made the rubber too stiff) This worked just like a zipper and went pretty fast. After I was about half way around, the glass settled into place. The rest of the install was easy, I just zipped it in.

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The front windshield was the exact same process, no trim. The only difference was that I started at the bottom middle, moving towards the drivers side, and once I was half way around (at the top middle), it got a difficult to do my zipper technique. So I went back to the bottom middle and pulled the cord and zippered along the passenger side and then up. This went very smooth. Once I moved past the lower passenger corner, the windshield settled into place. The rest zipped easy. Once I was finished, my daughter cleaned the glass.

I put the trim in several days later. It was not that difficult, but again took a process. I slide the trim edge that was on the paint side into the groove. I used a small round shaft screwdriver to roll the glass side edge of the rubber over the trim.

My guess is that this process works well wih new rubber. The process may be different if an older gasket were used

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