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spings and struts are on! Big problem!


deadflo

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OK many of you may recall I've been posting questions about spring and strut choices for about a year, and finally settled on ST springs and Tockico HP's . My mechanic(who has owned 240-Z's) put em on today, and..

It's another case of the front end being over two inches taller, while the rear is OK. Note before and after pics.:stupid:

We do have the springs marked as "front" on the front end.

I was involved in thread regarding the ride height issues caused by newer gas pressurized shocks. But you may recall there was opinion voiced that newer spring designs, including the ST's would not have the increased ride height issue, with modern shocks.

This really sucks, so I'm hoping someone has a good idea on how to lower the front.

Maybe cut the fronts by one turn?

I know my mechanic weirded out that these "lowering" springs fit loosely in the perches, but I assured him from our club info that was normal.

If we cut a bit off, will they stay in the perches long enough to lower the car?

Other option is I still have the older yellow St's or Interpart springs that were on there before. I wonder if I could switch back to those front springs, or do you think the gas struts would just bring those up two inches as well?

I bought the springs and struts from the Shox.com guys.

They told me to call back if i had any questions when I ordered em, I thought I'd ask you guys for some advice first..

PS,

Ridewise it didnt seem to bad. My mechanic thought it was bone harsh, but he sold his 240-Z's to get into Studebakers.ROFL

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post-5999-14150800604473_thumb.jpg

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Front end is out of whack. I am not faniliar with those springs but maybe the Tokico shocks were reversed front to rear???

I used the Tokico spring and shock package and it lowered car all around about an inch of so.

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Do you recall which springs were longer? Should be longer in back, regardless of what the stickers said...

If you have them in right, you can cut 1/2 coils until you get the height you want. Cut with a cutoff wheel, not a torch. Also check the available travel on the strut. No point in lowering it so far that it rides on the bumpstops.

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Arne, I'll check in the morning to see if I can count the coils on the fronts and rears, and see if it looks like the springs were mislabled.

Did BuDavid ever do the switch on his springs?

Interesting he he had mislabled springs from shox.com.

Because that would be exactly what happened to me.

If thats the case, it would be nice to have some sort of price break.

Anyway, I also recall another thread:

http://classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21115

Where it seemed it was the tockico HP's to blame. If it looks like we have the springs in correctly, I am going to guess that is the case.

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Different story on that thread - on that one both ends were tall, not just the front. (At least, that was the case after all four were installed.) Your situation seems more like BuDavid's.

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Front end is out of whack. I am not faniliar with those springs but maybe the Tokico shocks were reversed front to rear???

I used the Tokico spring and shock package and it lowered car all around about an inch of so.

Ron,

I have used that same package (Tokico springs and struts) and in every case my ride height was even from front to rear. The only exception is when I installed the Tokico HP struts and Tokico springs on my '86 300ZX the ride height was slightly lower in the front but aparently this is common for the Z31when using the Tokico combo.

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Well I called shox.com, where they then referred to a direct phone number to the manufacturer(or maybe the importer?) KW automotive. They gave me some more info on the ST springs. I was told the front springs would have slightly thinner wire and be 9 TURNS . Not coils per se, but turns. In other words the half turn legnth at either end does not count as a coil, but if you follow through to the next coil in the same place as the first half legnth , that would be one turn. (hope you can follow that). I will check later today if I get a chance.

As far as any credit, I talked to one fellow who said I could document the problem with good pics, and an estimate from my mechanic as to the cost to redo, there was a CHANCE I could get some compensation.

I did send those folks the link to this thread, to give them an idea that other members of our club would be interested in the results, implying that their customer service and accuracy in labeling the springs correctly would be a factor on future sales from our club members.

BTW, they said if itlooks like the springs were labeled correctly, it would be best to pull em off and sendem back to the manufacurer where they would "test them to make sure they were for the correct application".

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Hey Deadflo

Sorry to hear you have to disassemble - bit of a pain:disappoin . My problem was all around like your front end and new Eibach springs solved it very nicely. I just added a few shots to my photo gallery that show the current set up.

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OK, well we've had a chance to look at the springs, and it appears the culprit is indeed mislabled srpings from ST!

The springs labled as "front" were 8 turns, but .498 inch in diameter. The rears (which had no label!) were .4515 inch in diameter, and had nine turns.

Ok well before you say the rears had more tunrs, that must be right,

recall that a represenative from ST manufacturer, KW automitive told me via phone"the fronts should have nine turns and be thinner."

I just sent an email to the ST people with the results, and well see what they say.

I plan to send them digital photos of the spring measurments as well as an estimate of what it will cost me for a redo. My mechainic and I feel it would be easiest to just re-do the fronts, since the rear sits pretty good.

If they dont help me I may resort to replacing the front springs with the old Yellow "interparts" or old ST's I took off. We''ll see what the resulting ride height will be.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Just a note to say I am still hanging out waiting for some sort of decision from KW Automotive, tha manufacturer of ST springs. I have sent them documentation of the mislabeled springs with photos of caliper measuremnts of the springs, the before and after shots of the car, receipts from Shox,.com for the purchase,and a receipt from my mechanic for the 356 dollars to install them.

I was told by a KW rep that he was putting together a case for me to take to his superiors, again in an effort to get some sort of compensation for the springs being mislabeled. Someone called my home on Monday and said a person working on my case would get back to me yesterday. But nothing has happened yet.

Whatever the result, you will hear what happens. It could be good news for me or bad, but other club members will get a good idea of how this company operates. BTW, i finally got the shox. com foks to get involved. They called me back after I sent them an email, and they agreed to send a message to the KW folks asking for them to help figure out the issue to my satisfaction.

I tried to impress upon both parties that our club would be looking to see how they fixed the situation.

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I don't know what you are trying to do with your car, but I installed new OEM stock springs and KYB strut inserts and it's plenty firm to me. Some of my bushings are poly, but not all. I can push the front fender down at most an inch. I also installed Suspension Techniques anti-sway bars front and rear. I think this is the best combo for a road car.

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Well I was looking for a firm ride, as this is not a commuter car and will be driven mostly on the twisty two lanes.

What I now need is for the front springs to be installed on the front and the rears in the rear. But thanks to the manufacturer mislabeling the springs, my car sits high in the front like a boat, with the softer springs on the rear. It sucks.

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If cost is an issue, and ST won't help you, you could always just swap them your self. Since the ST springs are short, now a spring compressor is no longer needed. That means with a jack, some good jackstands and normal metric hand tools you should be able to do it in a weekend even if you take it very slowly. You might need a helper to bleed the brakes, but that's it. An experienced person should be able to change them all in 2 hours, three at the most.

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I don't know what you are trying to do with your car, but I installed new OEM stock springs and KYB strut inserts and it's plenty firm to me. Some of my bushings are poly, but not all. I can push the front fender down at most an inch. I also installed Suspension Techniques anti-sway bars front and rear. I think this is the best combo for a road car.
I've also found that stock springs and KYBs make for a good driver.
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  • 1 month later...

It looks like there will be a happy ending to this story. After documenting the issue with photos and receipts from my mechaninc, JW Automotive, the California manufacturer of ST springs, has sent me a release form to sign before they send me a check to have my mechanic switch out the springs front to back. Hopefully that will be the end of it. I have been driving the Z in its boat-like configuration all summer. The rear is pretty bouncy, because of the softer spring rates in the back, plus the obvious ride height issue.

I think they finally moved to help me out after I contaced their parent company in Germany, and i got a resposne back from that office saying they wanted to make sure I was satisfied with my purcahse from them. I had also contacted our State Consumer protection folks, who this week finally sent me a letter stating they would be pursuing the case.

I will let you know how the switch works out.

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Ten-Four Bob, seems thats way evereything is going now. Glad to hear you might have the problem solved Steve. I see your in Spokane. I'm from Newport just north about an hour if you go the limit:devious:. I'd love to see your Zs up close. Drop me a PM if your interested.

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