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Power antenna electrics


TomoHawk

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I found out my 280Z has a power antenna ( OEM one, I think), but the radio isn't connected to it, AFAIK. Modern radio.

1. Can you disconnect the antenna wire at the antenna and hook up a plain one instead?

2. Can you activate it by jumping the lead near the radio or something? It might be neat to see if I can get it to go up & down, if it still works.

thx

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Lance,

My Mitchell's wiring diagram doesn't even have a radio on it so any info or pointer to a wiring pic would be helpful. I assumed there would be an arial connection at the antenna itself, but wasn't able to get the thing out, or get my eyes in there to look.

One further question would be which wire behind the console is it and what do you connect to it, 12V?

thx

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Short term solution is to bookmark this site: http://www.atlanticz.ca/zclub/techtips/

You'll find a wiring diagram for the 78 there.

Long term solution is to get a factory service manual. Look for them on eBay, buy the CD at http://www.courtesyparts.com or try your local Nissan dealer (sometimes you get lucky). The FSM will have pictures of some of the wiring, especially connectors.

Don't own a Z without it.

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I have a service manual. Went through it again and I found a couple things that will help. See attached pics.

The answer is that connecting the right pins on the radio , you can get it to go up or down (if it still works).

Thanks for reminding me to try sgain. :classic:

thx

post-2169-14150795807238_thumb.jpg

post-2169-14150795807417_thumb.jpg

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Looks like you found the info you needed, I couldn't help more since all I have is 240 stuff and I'm sure the wiring is different. Thing to remember is that these antennas don't have limit switches (at least my 240 didn't) so you must turn them off when you reach full up/full down. Use a single pole double throw center off switch. I worked mine this way for a while until I replaced it with a rubber antenna, got tired of jerks breaking it off when I would forget to put it down.

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I was just wondering if that old thing still worked. A patch wire is all that I"ll need to test it, assuming I can find the radio end of the wires. If it still works, I'll eBay it ($$!). I thought it was just a plain mast antenna, so I was going to just throw it away and replace it with an invisible window-mounted wire.

thx

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...Use a single pole double throw center off switch. ....
Emphasis mine.

CORRECTION: Use a MOMENTARY Single Pole Double Throw Switch.

If you don't specify a Momentary switch, the Center OFF requirement would give you a switch with 4 leads to connect to. A momentary switch only has 3 connection points. This also eliminates the possibility of burning out the motor on the antenna due to leaving the switch on either the UP or DOWN positions.

The 240's and: from the drawings that Tomo posted: show that they are using the same type of antenna. The switch only serves to route 12v+ to either one wire or the other. The reversal of polarity is what causes the motor to reverse it's direction.

On the newer style antennas, they are constantly powered, but they have a solenoid attached close to the motor that detects when current is flowing to the radio, and piggyback on this current, which then lets the antenna go up. When THAT current is removed (when you shut off the radio) the antenna goes down. The limiting switch is usually a gear or micro-switch that detects the full up/down position and then interrupts the constant power. That's why if you turn on your car and had left the radio on the last time you rode in the car, the antenna and radio would promptly go up. Then when you shut off the car, the antenna would still be powered so that it could go down.

Tomo, if you are serious about selling that antenna, would PM me? I would also be interested even if the motor doesn't work, but the shaft is ok.

2¢

Enrique

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I dunno about selling it to you. The shaft is OK. but not too tight and slips back down some. Maybe using the motor would fix that. I'll have to extract it and let you know. I'm not in a huirry to do that- maybe over the winter.

I understand about the switch. I was going to use as momentary rocker switch even though you suggested something different.

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That is the switch. Not sure if that's the correct one for Tomo's car though.

AFAIK, the switch mounted above the right hand knob, that was operated horizontally was on the earlier cars, and the switch mounted to the right of the right hand knob and operated vertically was for the later models. Additionally the earlier switch was a "traditional" switch , i.e. rectangular knob with grooves that you slid to one side or the other, whereas the later ones were rounded a rocker style switch.

Enrique

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  • 3 weeks later...

This is the only item that does not work on my 2/71 240Z. It worked before I disassembled the car for resto. Now, the antennae does not work. I believe I grounded it properly. I used the next size larger metal screw in the same hole to ensure the screw hole was clean and the connection was tight. The radio just keeps searching with the antennae down. Any ideas?

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The radio searching says that it isn't getting a signal strong enough to lock onto. That has nothing to do with the operation of the antenna's motor. If you were to pull up on the antenna mast (DON'T) the radio should find a signal and lock onto it. This is as long as the coax cable for the antenna isn't broken, or disconnected at either end.

The antenna's motor NOT operating, is either because you did not connect it to the antenna switch at the radio's faceplate, at the antenna, or you didn't change the in-line fuse behind the radio. Look for a BLUE wire with an in-line fuse back amongst the wires behind the HCP. Check and / or replace the fuse. If the fuse is ok, then check to make sure that the antenna is properly plugged into the wiring.

This of course presumes that this an OEM Antenna and an OEM Radio. As such, remember that the two wires going to the antenna are BOTH for the POSITIVE portion of the electricity. The Negative is provided by the ground at the back as Gunner posted. The switch is just a diverter valve. The motor operates in the direction of current. Reverse the current, the motor operates backward.

If the antenna is NOT an OEM style, i.e One of various Automatic Operations, be aware that it will NOT readily plug into the Z's Harness nor will it operate with the OEM radio without some re-wiring.

Automatic Antenna's nowdays are the full up/ full down variety paired with the radio's on/off status. This requires the antenna to receive continuous power, while sensing the radio's operation via a relay. Radio goes on -- antenna goes up; radio off, down even though the power has been cut off. The OEM antenna differed in that you determined how far up / down the antenna went based on how long you held the switch in the appropriate direction.

If you want the full automatic mode, you must provide continuous power to the antenna, which is somewhat difficult at the back of the car, on the far end of the wiring harness. It's not an easy chore to bring a wire through the labyrinth of turns and holes it must go through to get back there. Yet, it's the only way to hide the wiring. Either that or you run it along the driver's side and bury it under the floor vinyl or worse yet, the transmission tunnel and over (or through) the tool boxes.

To connect the OEM radio to an automatic antenna using the ORIGINAL wiring for the automatic antenna do the following:

To use the OEM Antenna Switch with the Automatic Antenna to simulate the OEM Antenna operation (i.e. User determined Height) the trick is in how you provide power to it.

At the HCP, you'll see 3 wires coming through a connector, a solid Blue wire and two others. The solid Blue is Positive Power coming directly through the fuse box, via the Air Conditioning circuit (This blue wire ALSO provides power to the radio). The other two wires are to send the current to one circuit or the other providing up/down at the motor. You won't be making any changes here, just take note which wire connects to the UP / DOWN terminals of the OEM Switch.

At the antenna, find the connector coming from the cash and select the wire that lowers the antenna. To this wire, connect the Positive power wire for the antenna. At the other connector, connect the BLUE lead (usual color for the on/off detect wire) AND a wire that connects to the Positive power wire.

The operation of the Auto Antenna is such that with continuous power, it's default position is in the DOWN position. When it senses current through its Blue wire, then it's relay reverses it's internal polarity and raises the antenna. When power is no longer sensed through the Blue wire, it defaults to it's normal polarity and the antenna is lowered. (Travel in either direction is usually limited by a gear / cam switch that disconnects power at the full up/ down position.)

The method of wiring that I mentioned, allows you to provide SELECTIVE power to the antenna AND it's current sensor. When you do that, the antenna raises. When you move the switch in the opposite direction, power is fed ONLY to the positive lead and NOT to the Blue, this defaults the antenna to lower itself. Since you are controlling the current at the antenna switch, you have full control of how high / down the antenna works.

Using the OEM wiring with an Automatic Antenna AND a newer style radio: (Note: the antenna switch will not be required)

Connect the Blue (+) wire to one of the two wires going to the antenna, and connect the Blue wire coming from the radio to the other. At the antenna connect the (+) lead to the antenna to the first wire above, and the Blue sensing wire to the other lead. This should help you avoid having to run a bunch of wires back there.

Hope this helps.

Enrique

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I have not checked to see if the "switch" is connected. I have had the wires out a couple of times. I will check tomorrow. I am in a metal building so I cannot get very good reception on a AM radio. the radio is searching but there is no antennae. I will check it all out tomorrow. Thanks for the specific info on the antennae. It is OEM and has all of the switches, wires and fuses. It worked before I took it apart. I think the switch is not connected at the radio. Good suggestion on checking this out. Thanks!

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  • 2 months later...

I just checked one last nite.The blue and red wire is the power supply The blue and white is the signal.I have a old manual switch that i cut off to expose the three wires

Solid blue is the hot i spliced the solid blue and the blue and red together then i just touched the two hots the blue and white to send a signal to the antenna.This was done in the car but i suppose you could test one on a bench by hooking up the B/R and the ground to a battery and touch the B/W to the hot.WORKED FOR ME good luck.

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  • 11 months later...

Took my left side rear panel out and got to the antennae wires. I had carefully hooked up the power wire to ground. How could I have been soooo stupid. Hooked everything up correctly and the antennae works like a champ. I have the old system that you need to power up and power down the antennae.

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E-

So it sounds like you need a singe-throw (SPST) switch that stays in the up or down setting? So either it's up or it's NOT up with the new ones.

The OEM switch is a Single Pole - Double Throw. One wire, two possible connection points. Additionally, it is a Momentay SPDT, which basically means that it spring centers itself to the Center Off position.

The circuit changes I noted above were to be able to make a FULLY Automatic Antenna work with the OEM wiring. This has been referred to as "fooling" the antenna. However, there is a mistake in there and I apologize for not having found it sooner.

Once I went back to re-examine the wiring of the antenna we "fooled", I realized that the OEM Switch will NOT do this job.

You MUST use a DPDT. Ideally, a Momentary Center Off is best.

The changes due to the correct Switch wiring are as follows:

UP (Top 2 connections) = Blue/Red Blue/White - 2 wires going TO Antenna

Center OFF (Mid 2) = Blue shunted to Blue - Same Power wire from Dash to BOTH center connections

BOTTOM (Low 2) = Blue/Red wire shunt from Top Left. Nothing on Right

At the Antenna, the Blue/Red is used for the Continuous 12v + connection (usually RED), and the Blue/White is used for the Power-ON sensor connection (usually BLUE). The Antenna is further connected to ground via either it's case or a separate wire.

In operation, when the switch is in the UP position, 12V+ is fed to BOTH the antenna's RED and BLUE wire, connecting it as if the radio had been turned on...the internal relay will allow the antenna to raise as long as you hold the switch in positon. When you release, all power is disconnected and the antenna is frozen in position.

When you slide the switch to the DOWN position, now only the RED wire receives power, and the BLUE does not, which mimics the power situation when a radio equipped to use a Full Auto Antenna is powered off, this causes the internal relay of the antenna to power the motor to bring the antenna down. Again, it retracts as long as you keep the switch in the down position, freezing when you release.

Typically, the antenna spool will also have limit contacts that will disconnect the power in either the UP or DOWN circuitry at it's most extreme points of travel.

This means that if you were unable to get a MOMENTARY Center Off DPDT switch, the antenna SHOULD disconnect at the extreme TOP and BOTTOM of travel.

But having goofed once, I'll admit that I've not tested this part out. I've been lucky to find DPDT Center OFF switches.

FWIW

E

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