Carl Beck

Hi Kats: I can't say for certain that I haven't heard the phrase .."poor man's Porsche" applied to the 240-Z, but if I did, it wasn't very often. As others have suggested, that phrase was more often applied to the VW/Porsche 914 when introduced, then later to the ill fated 924/944... here in the States. In 1970 the Porsche Owners of America would not allow owners of the VW built Porsche 914 to join their club, as the car was sold in Europe as a VW. The Prosche Factory in-turn, threatened to withdraw support form and association with, the club... so finally the club yielded... Porsche introducing the 914/6 also helped the image of the 914 series here... but not a whole lot. Porsche sold to an up-scale market, with higher prices and more limited production here in the U.S., and the Datsun 240-Z wasn't intended to penetrate that market. I don't believe that any of the people that bought 240-Z's, that I knew, did so because they wanted a Porsche but couldn't afford one. (I sold my 911 about six months after buying the 240Z). For the most part the people that bought Datsun 240-Z's did so because first and foremost it was a strikingly beautiful design. I would say that the styling alone attracted about 70% of the buyers - very few if any of which had ever wanted a Sports or Grand Touring Car before. About 30% of the buyers were already "Sport Car People". The fact of the matter is that the 240-Z had so much "Charisma" - that the truly wealthy people were buying/driving them - Hollywood Starts, Leading Sports Superstarts, High Tec. Gurus.. All people that could afford a Ferrari.... and they were paying the Datsun Dealers $3K to $5K over MSRP to get to the head of the list. (per Mr. Sage at Universal Datsun in L.A.).... In addition to it's beautiful lines - it could be rationalized for purchase, as a useful second car for the family, because it presented great "utility" with the large cargo area and hatch back design. None of these people bought the Z instead of a Porsche. The Z car was built to accommodate the average size American with lots of head and leg room (something sorely lacking in it's British and Italian competition). It also offered performance that would keep up with traffic, as well as providing comfort traveling the long distances between States on our Freeways. The real PLUS with the Datsun 240-Z was the proven reliability of the previous Datsun's sold in the States - especially the wildly successful DATSUN 510. The Datsun 240-Z was priced about the same as it's market competition. Fiat 124, MGB-GT, Triumph TR-6, Triumph GT6, Opel GT, SAAB Sonnet, Capri V6 - - and for the most part they are the cars that went out of business as the Datsun 240-Z soaked up their customer base. (even if the Datsun buyer had to pay a Dealer premium far above the MSRP - making a Z purchase far more expensive than buying its competition at the time). FWIW, Carl B.

If the spindle pin will not come out - then you need both of the parts it holds together - YES/NO?? Plus a new spindle pin. YES/NO? If the shop can't get the old one out - they shouldn't be doing suspension work. If they can't get it out - they should take the assembly to a machine shop and let them take it out. It isn't your fault they have their lift tied up -it''s their problem. Tell them to just put the car back together - and leave the driver's side bushings inside the car... then take it to someone that knows what they are doing. FWIW, Carl B.

13 of 36 Put the luggage straps back in.. and retake the picture 19 of 36 The side of the dash "looks" like it has orange overspray - fix that. (or use 24 of 36 and photoshop the orange glow out - as long as it really isn't there to begin with) The door panels have HOLES cut in them - that will hurt the sale.. Your call as to replace them or not. Lose the half dash cap - it looks to much like a cheap fix.... and makes people wonder what else you cheap screwed. Just tell people the dash is cracked as usual. 31 of 36 Battery Area - Did you remove the surface rust - and repaint as necessary? (ah I see in 34 of 36 that you cleaned it up.. 32 of 36 72 Carb's with 73 air cleaner... No battery hold down??? - return to OEM!! Get the shock tower plastic caps in place or explain that the shocks are adjustable... 16, 17, 18 of 36 are good detail shots to use in the E-Bay Ad.... You need better close up's of the rear deck threshold, the doglegs/rockers.... Use: 04 of 36 = Front View 05 of 36 = Rear View 07 of 36=Right Side View 08 of 36= Left Side View Reserve = $14,500.00 Buy-it-now = $17,500.00

Hi Will: Thanks, I feel better all ready! I have to admit that it was a trying but very rewarding trip. I want to tell everyone here, that the entire process was made far easier, indeed possible by the help from some very supportive Z Car friends. Will in particular - scouted out locations for the photo shoot, made arrangements with the Park Personnel, and alleviated the concerns of Mr. and Mrs Brock related to State Permits etc... Nothing could have been done about the weather, but Will pretty much took care of everything else. Oh by the way, he also picked the Brock's up at the Hotel, brought them to the site and then took them back!! Dr. Bill Coffey and Dr. Rich Lewis (two Z Car Original Owners) showed up in Rich's 4WD Yukon.. which we used to pull the car/trailer through the sand dunes and resulting high speed wind driven sand drifts.. and out onto the beach!! 280ZMaster (John) filled in taxi duty, taking people to from the the parking lot / photo shoot; after they had their cars stuck in the sand and were not able to get to the beach... it was indeed a group effort... and I greatly appreciated the support. Will is right of course - Getting the BRE BAJA Z back together with Mr. Brock was a real thrill for me, and Mr. Brock could not have been any more generous in his support during the restoration process, nor in his review of the finished (will almost finished) result. I've been a huge BRE fan since the beginning and indeed a follower of Peter Brock since he pinned the first drawings of the mid-year Corvettes at GM. My appreciation for his capability in the field of Design, grew when I first saw the Shelby Cobra Daytona Coupe.... Of all the forms of competition he was involved in, competing at the Baja was the event he most enjoyed and most wanted to win. He felt that the BAJA represented the greatest challenge possible to any racing shop. Of course not too many of the Sports Car magazines carried much news about BRE's BAJA efforts with Datsun... so not many people today are at all aware of BRE's 510's, Datsun Trucks, and the Z Car they fielded between 69 and 73 at the BAJA. However the BRE cars and trucks, as well as Mr. Brock himself, are very well known by the Off-Road Racers. The BRE BAJA Z was really an attempt by Mr. Brock to bring the Off-Road Racing enthusiasts closer together with the World Rally Championship events, by fielding a very noticeable DATSUN 240-Z at the BAJA. The colors and graphic design of the BRE Z's and 510's were as important to the promotion of the DATSUN Brand, as the competition efforts of the BRE Teams. While the BRE Baja Z was as fast on the dirt trail sections of the race as Parnelli Jone's famous "Big Oly" Bronco .... the Z was simply not as competitive on Baja's boulder strewn, rock crawling sections... Being there with a very noticeable Datsun 240-Z was the main goal however, and that goal was meet. Indeed many years later, Mexico has a WRC event - that runs many of the roads (dirt trails?) used for the Baja 1000 over the years. My main goal in restoring the BRE BAJA Z was to bring this important piece of DATSUN/BRE History to the forefront again. It is really a shame that NISSAN dropped support of the Factory Backed efforts for competition in the US in 1973 ....With farther Factory financial support, off road and rally competition development, and above all Promotion - we might have seen the WRC cars running at the BAJA 1000 - in their own class, on routes suitable to them decades sooner. I was very happy to see the BRE2.net web site brought on-line, as it contains a lot of information about the BRE's efforts at the Baja, also not commonly seen in our Sports Car Magazines... Pictures below: The BRE Baja Z in 73 and a couple of WRC cars in the 2008 Rally Mexico FWIW, Carl B.

That's BRE2.net or http://BRE2.net

I'm not certain when - but the early cars had cut-out's for the luggage straps, and later cars simply had holes for the mounting screws to go though, with the fasteners on top of the carpet. I noticed this on my early production 72 Z (11/71). FWIW, Carl B.

- - - - - - - - - - 240-Z CARPET FASTENERS Bulletin Number TS72-56, June 13,1972 Predelivery Service: To keep the front floor carpet in position, four fasterners are now included in each 240-Z. These fasteners are in the glove compartment of each car, and must be installed at the pre-delivery inspection according to the illustration. Beginning Serial Number: HLS30-77533 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - That would be a build date of 04/72 and later.... Just an FYI... FWIW, Carl B.

Hi John: That car was made for your Daughter... It was great to meet you, your Wife and Daughter at Amelia. You have to be very careful what cars your kids stand next too for photographs when they are little..... you might wind up buying the cars when they are older!! Here is a picture of my son (the one that was with me at Amelia), standing next to a Ferrari that we saw at the 24 Hours of Daytona, when he was about 9.... 9 years later I wound up buying the car! Karma???

Hi Chris: I took the BRE Baja Z to Amelia Island - but not for the Concours. Pete Brock did a private photo shoot for Classic Motorsports/Grassroots Motorsports, and we staged the car at Huguenot Memorial Park just South of Amelia. I have an invitation for the BRE Baja Z for the Concours in 2009, but did not have it finished for planning for inclusion for this years event. The main purpose of the trip to Amelia was simply to get Mr. Brock together with the car again etc. As it was a private photo shoot - I won't be publishing any pictures from there, until after they are published by the magazine that paid for the photo's .. I've also ask the people that were invited to come along for a private get-together on the beach with Mr. and Mrs Brock to hold off publishing pictures from there until the magazine article is published. It was a rough weekend to say the least - but I think the pictures will come out looking great. Mr. Brock seemed quite pleased to see his Z looking new again, and I was able to fill in more of the history of the car and it's purpose etc. By the time Saturday was over - given the trying weather, the trip to/from Amelia and the long photo shoot - I was shot... it's hell getting old... so I didn't stay for Sunday's events... but rather took the time for the return trip to Clearwater.... FWIW, Carl B.

Mineral Spirits, Jet Fuel, Kerosene, Diesel Fuel, Fuel Oil are all refined/distilled products of crude oil... all of them are solvents for tar based undercoatings. Mineral Spirits are EXPENSIVE today - Kerosene would be the best trade-off between cost and effectiveness. All of them are FLAMABLE at various Flash Points... but used carefully, outside, with good ventilation you can use kerosene. Turpentine - is a refined product from tree sap... not related to the refined crude oil products. FWIW, Carl B.

I made a replacement for the OEM center finisher (deleting the original heater/fresh air controls) out of alumiunm sheet - then used the larger center vent from Vintage Air and mounted the V.A. controls there.... At the time - it was an experimental setup... kind of ugly... but it worked fine. For a really "custom" setup - I'd replace the entire transmisson center console - and build a new one with cold air pipeing through it - to deliver cold air to the rear deck area. There is a huge hot spot back there, that gets very little air circulation... FWIW, Carl B.

I'll check them again - but the columns seem to line up in order with the list you provided. I believe I stated that they very well could have been Standard on the Z-L, but none of the images you Posted had mention of them one way or the other. Yes - and I tried to take careful notes - to summarize the information in the theads. I have done that - and the Standard Equipment on the Z-L seems to be the same. The brief summary of "Standard Equipment" that I Posted at #10, was intended to answer Kerrigan's question - "what makes it an "L". My understanding was that the "L" had more Standard Equipment than the base model. I posted only the Fairlady Z to establish the "base model" and the Z-L so Kerrigan could see what was additional, and additional to what. I posted the 70/71 US spec. so he could compare his car to other US spec. cars around him. He said he had a 1971 model, so that is what I used. Looking at the Late Model 71 brochure - the Standard Equipment on the Z-L seems to be the same. I was simply trying to answer his specific question - not attempting to write a comprehensive article covering all models and years. I'm getting ready to leave for the weekend, so will have to stop for now. (I'll be at the Amelia Island Concurs in case anyone else is planing on being there) I'll review the earlier threads more closely - but a brief scan of the brochures you Posted - in the threads you referred to - still shows no mention of the six items in question (FULL CARPET, TINTED GLASS, UNDERHOOD LIGHT, MAP LIGHT and STEERING WHEEL LOCK) as being Standard Equipment on the Z-L. FWIW, Carl B.

Hi Alan: The info for the Standard Equipment on the Fairlady Z and Z-L - is from the documents and translations you published here. I took your explanations and translations, and made notes on the images you supplied in several threads for reference.. You Wrote in relation to the images: Read across the columns to see what is Option and what is Standard Equipment. A blank means it is not available on that model. Gray Square represented "Standard Equipment" on the images... *5-speed Transmission. *165HR-14 Tyres. *Air Con Kit. *Leather Handle. ( 'Handle' = steering wheel in the Japanese vernacular ) *Leather Shift Lever Knob. *Car Stereo. *Stop Watch Clock. *Two Hands style Clock. ( the normal clock ) *Reclining Seat Device. *Passing Light. *Fog Lamp. and Again, reading from left to right across the top: *Dual Exhaust. ( that's the full twin-pipe system, standard equipment on the Z432 ) *Leather Top. ( actually vinyl ) *Racing Stripe. *Rubber Bumper. ( refers to the bumper trim which was standard on the Z-L and Z432 ) *Over Rider. *Electrically Heated Rear Glass. *Headlamp Covers. *Roll Bar. *Air Spoiler. ( that's the early-shape one, often mistakenly called the "BRE" spoiler in the USA ) *Assistant's Footrest. *FM Pack. The info for the US 240-Z is from the 70/71 Sales Brochures If you see information that is wrong - by all means add the correct info. and I'll correct my notes. FWIW, Carl B.

The Vintage Air - Super Cooler III - replaces the OEM heater box/core. So it sits up on the transmission tunnel where the OEM system was - and extends over the passenger footwell - but far above the Dealer Installed units of the 70's, and above the original position of the fan. The Dealer Installed units - were added onto the existing OEM heater/fresh air vent system. As such air is sucked through the evaporator by the fan, then blown through the OEM system. With all the parts put together, you run into "leaks" where hot cabin air is sucked in, instead of all the air flowing though the evaporator... plus the added restriction to air flow by adding the evaporator ahead of the existing fan. Upgrades to the fan itself help - but they don't overcome the compromised design. As you note - the Vintage Air unit combines the evaporator coils with the heater coils in one box, and the fan blows through it. The VA unit's fan moves about twice as much air as the Dealer Installed set up did. It will cool the car.. The downside is the unit will not use the original controls. You can disconnect them and leave them in place - then put the VA control unit in the glove box if you want to maintain the oem look. Personally, for my driver - I eliminated the oem controls - and installed a larger center vent to move more air toward the rear of the car, between the front seats.. Even so - there are still so many issues with the body design and construction - you will not get an A/C system to work nearly as well in a 240-Z, as you will find in almost any modern car. The Z is a rolling greenhouse - which leaks air at highway speeds, as the side windows bulge out. The inlet for any of these units is below the dash on the passenger side of the car - so cold air coming out the right side and center outlets, gets sucked back into the system before it can circulate though the cabin. The obstructions to air flow - the seats, the set up to the rear deck area - have to be overcome somehow... so rear cold air outlets really need to be installed.... None of the units use Fresh Air to mix in with the recirculated cabin air - they are all recirculate cabin air only. This can leave the cabin musty with stale air... So you crack a window to get some fresh air in - then the evaporator coils freeze up when the moist outside air hits it.... One could do a fully custom system - by taking a modern A/C system out of some modern small car. Then if your willing to cut into the firewall, or do whatever is necessary - you could install an A/C system with fresh air circulation, and one powerful enough to do a decent job... I'm sure it could be done ..... Second option is to install a Rear A/C unit - to circulate more air throughout the cabin. Of course you'd have to live with the looks of it... FWIW, Carl B.

4 Million Yen = $38,974.96 USD

Sounds like the "Midwest Z Heritage Fest" ... has been turned into the "All Nissan/Infiniti/Datsun Fest". Why do people feel that successful events have to be made ever LARGER, or have to be EXPANDED? Money, money, money perhaps... A desire to be more "inclusive" in order to dilute the exclusive nature of owning a Classic Car? A true belief that diversity will lead to a cohesive and well functioning group? hummm...... FWIW, Carl B.

Hi Kats: The Fairlady Z's in the US will usually sell for about 75% to 80% of the value of a like condition, US Spec. 240-Z. Very understandable that people want cars they can drive - on the correct side of the road ;-), from the correct side of the car ;-) Given that about 3% of the 240-Z's produced, were sold in Japan, it is also understandable that being far more rare - their value would be higher than the US or Left Hand versions there. We don't know what percentage of the 240-Z's sold in Japan were 240-ZG's.. but it has to be a very limited number and again, it is understandable that they would command a higher price as well. Given the very limited number of 432's produced, the even more limited number of them remaining - and given the "neat" factors involved - I'd expect them to always command prices of at least two to three times the value of the regular production cars. So your view of the market in Japan seems very reasonable to me at this point. I'd have to agree that $60K USD is a bit high - when you can buy a Vintage Z in the US for $40K. It doesn't cost $20K to ship a car to Japan. "not selling" might also be a matter of the owner not really "Selling" the car - not advertising it properly nor promoting it properly etc. No Classic Car should be considered as a very liquid asset. It can take months and months to put a buyer together with a seller of any Special Interest or Classic Car. If your logic related to age/time and a cars depreciation were correct - then we should see the prices for all Classic Cars from the 40's and 50's going down in value now. We don't. We see all very desirable models of Classic Cars appreciating at reasonable rates.. from the 40's, 50's and 60's. Any discussion of the present and future "values" of "Classic Cars" has to be within the context of normalized dollars - ie. you have to factor out the inflation/deflation of the currency and hold values to constant units. If you do that, and you look at the buying/selling prices for most true Classic Cars - over time they hold their value, and/or appreciate at reasonable rates... The example of using a Model A roadster, really isn't applicable. While the Model T's and A's have always been interesting parts of automotive history - there is simply nothing "Classic" about them in the sense of the word meaning "of timeless beauty". Let me say that again for emphasis - "OF TIMELESS BEAUTY". Apply that definition to any Classic Car - and you will find that the cars that fit that definition - have always appreciated in value over time. Generation after Generation of car enthusiasts desire the beautiful lines of the real Classic Sports/GT's.. With growing populations of people world wide - there are growing numbers of automobile enthusiasts - at the time that there are an ever more limited number of true Classic Sports/GT's available. In the past 12 years alone, 400,000,000 Chinese have gained Middle Class standards of living... Just 40 years ago - a very small percentage people in Japan, could dream of owning a high powered, large, Sports GT... Let alone own one for purely pleasure use. I believe that your investment in both the Datsun 240-Z and the Fairlady Z 432 are very sound, and over the next 20 years you will see that value grow steadly over the long term. Even if there are short term up's and down's.... The Datsun 240-Z changed the world's opinion of the Japanese Auto Industry, it will always hold a significant place in automotive history - but more importantly - the Z is Of Timeless Beauty.... FWIW, Carl B.

Yes - correct - thank you Will... Carl B.

Yes, the 73 would bring slightly less money and it would take longer to find a buyer. For some reason the first of a desirable model run, always seems to be the most "pure" of form (styling) and "function", so it usually (although not always) demands the highest prices. Other times it's the last of that model that has the most improvements incorporated and thus becomes either the first or second most sought after. 55,56,57 T-Birds, 63-67 Corvette, 64-67 Pontiac GTO's. The 1973 240-Z's here in North America will always be hurt by the extended bumpers, emissions carb's. How big the gap in value between the 70-72 and 73's will be - I believe will depend on now many cars in total are saved... far better to have a 73 240-Z, than no 240-Z. Yes - non-Stock Carb.'s on a 73 would put you in the Modified Class many places, and many points would be deducted - carb.'s wrong, air cleaner wrong, intake manifold wrong.... plus all the points for wrong parts associated with the emissions equipment... FWIW, Carl B.

Those items (tinted glass, underhood light, map light and steering wheel lock) may very well have also been Standard Equipment on the Z-L, just not listed on the sales brochures. I didn't see them specifically listed as "optional" anywhere either. Alan / Kats ?? FWIW, Carl B.

I think that the "L" was Luxury... it had more "Standard Equipment". <pre> STANDARD EQUIPMENT <b>Datsun 240Z Fairlady Z-L Fairlady Z</b> 2.4L 150hp 2.0L 130hp 2.0L 130hp 4spd 3.36 Final 5spd. 3.9 Final 4spd. 175HR14 Radials 14" Bias-ply 14" Bias-ply AM Sig. Seeking AM/FM Stereo - - - - Electric Clock Stop Watch Clock - - - - Reclining Seats Relining Seats - - - - Rubber Bumper Rubber Bumper - - - - Rear Defrost Rear Defrost - - - - - - - Passing Light - - - - - - - Assistant's Footrest - - - - Full Carpet - - - - - - - - Tinted Glass - - - - - - - - Underhood Light - - - - - - - - Map Light - - - - - - - - CourtesyLight (door switch) - - - - - - - - Steering Wheel Lock - - - - - - - - Additional Color Standards 904 Dark Green - - - - - - - - - 907 White - - - - - - - - - 918 Orange - - - - - - - - - </pre> OPTIONS: Just about every "option" offered on the Fairlady and Fairlady Z-L at the Factory Outlets in Japan, were matched by Nissan Port Installed or Dealer Installed Options and/or Aftermarket Equipment here in the States: Dual Exhaust 5spd. Vinyl Top Racing Strip Bumper Over-Rider Headlight Covers Roll Bar Rear Spoiler Assistant Footrest FM Pack A/C Dealers here in the States were prohibited, by law, from changing any items related to the U.S. Emissions Standards. However the law did not prevent customers from making whatever changes they wanted in 49 of the 50 U.S. States and Canada. Although it doesn't seem to have been listed by Alan or Kats - I'm not sure about full carpet being Standard on the Z-L. ???? I could have missed it along the way. FWIW, Carl B.

if it checks out - its worth every penny of $15K. I'm not sure it would bring $18K with that mileage - but it wouldn't hurt to buy it at $18K if its the 280Z you always wanted. Agreed - the Dealer should sell at $15K... or even $14,500.00... FWIW, Carl B.

Of course not - - The Agreed Value on YOUR CAR is dependent upon the condition of YOUR CAR. If you insure your Z with a Classic/Collectable/Special Interest Insurer - their underwriters already know what cars they have insured, and what the Agreed Values are. You can call the Hagetry for example and you will find that - if the car is indeed a #1 or #2 example, or if it falls with a Special Interest group (Vintage Z's Race Cars, etc) they will have no problem with an Agreed Value in the $35K+ range. They won't let you over-insure a daily driver... but if you have a real #2 condition 240-Z they won't blink an eye at $30K. Agreed and I don't believe anyone said it was a "singular cause". It's one cause, others include increased demand as more people can afford to buy the cars they want, reduced supply as Collectors take very nice cars off the open market and stick them away, the devaluation of the Dollar's purchasing power.... agreed... and no one said it was simply the cost to restore... FWIW, Carl B.

I think they might be either a little optimistic... OR they haven't been shopping seriously for a 240-Z in the past year. They might be thinking that one can still buy a really nice, top level #3 car for $12K.. I haven't seen any sell for less than $16K in the past 18 months... A top level #3 Car would win Local Car Shows, and many State Level Shows in the Stock Class... I doubt you can buy that quality 240-Z today for $12K (if you can - DO!!). The biggest difference is the degree of fine detail, the level of perfection exerted to achieve "as it left the factory". When the Judges stand with a Judging Sheet, and closely inspect every nut, bolt and hose clamp to assure they are all "correct"... every thread in the upholstery.... every square inch of paint and body work... date stamps on the wheels, original keys, documentation packages, ..... and deduct a point or two for every picky flaw... a #2 car will not lose more than 5% of the available points. A great #3 car - won't have to have that level of detail perfection. They are judged more on an overall presentation basis. The best of the cars that show up at Local and State level events... They win their class, if no #1 nor #2 cars show up, and they come in 2nd if a #2 condition car shows up. Most serious "Enthusiasts" see a #3 car as nearly perfect - because they don't stand with a judging sheet in hand, and closely inspect every nut, bolt and screw. Rather most enthusiasts see the car in an over-all sense. They don't notice, nor do they care if every nut has the correct marking on its head.. they don't notice, nor do they care if every hose in the emissions system is "correct"... #1 and #2 Condition cars are for fanatic Collectors, driven by owning perfection. The usually won't buy anything any less. #3 Condition cars are for the people that love the Datsun 240-Z, know it wasn't perfect to begin with, and really never notice that someone had changed a few bolts... they just see the car as they saw it when it was new... in a very over-all sense. Huge Gap between #1/ #2 cars and #3 or less... #1/#2 cars are close in value - but almost always twice the price of a #3 car. They simply sell to quite different buyers, or at least for quite different uses. (some serous Collectors own both types - one to keep in the living room - and one to drive). Ask 26th Z - how pickey he can be when judging the Stock class at a National Convention. Very hard to judge a car from pictures... but it might be an interesting thread - we can all argue about "what is correct" or not. FWIW, Carl

Hi Arne: A #2 condtion 240-Z would win First In Class, in the STOCK Class at a National Z Car Convention. When judged by knowledgeable judges, when no #1 car shows up. These cars (#2) currently change hands in the $25K to $30K range. A #1 car - would be a Gold Medallion winner - and on top of that it would far exceed even the Gold Medallion standards. They would sell for $38K+ if one ever comes up for sale. if you can get it to that point for that amount of money - you should also get an award for personal effort. Or you were smart enough to have bought all the perfectly correct parts, years ago.... At any rate, win a First In Class at a National Convention... and you'll double your money. Hold the car for a few more years and you'll likely triple it, IF you maintain it in #2 condition. FWIW, Carl B.