Zed Head
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Viewing Topic: getting 1977 280z started
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saturday night music thread
That's a late one. Never heard it. I was listening to them on vinyl on a cheap record player with a penny taped on the stylus.
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getting 1977 280z started
p.s. did you measure voltage across the injector connector pins or from one injector connector pin to ground. The second way is the correct way. p.s. 2 you're falling in to the "it measured good" trap. We need the numbers.
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getting 1977 280z started
Did you disconnect the Neutronics thing? The EFI computer is sensitive to the tachometer/coil - signal on Pin 1. I see a "Power/Tach" label on the box, implying that it's also connected to Pin 1 or the coil. If the Neutronics box is shorted it could cause a no-start. Plus, there's no guarantee that it ever worked. Does the tachometer needle move when cranking? I also see some open vacuum lines in your picture. https://www.classiczcars.com/forums/topic/69545-1977-280z-ignitionfuel-system-neutronics/#comment-679115
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saturday night music thread
- 1977 280z ignition/fuel system "neutronics"
p.s. Neutronics Enterprises is still out there. Check out the email addresses here - https://neuracing.us/brushless-motor-engineering-and-manufacturing-based-in-sand-diego-ca/ Phone numbers - https://dieselnet.com/com/85.php Stop by and say hello - https://www.mapquest.com/us/california/neutronics-enterprises-inc-366412161 Here's a book that references the patent - https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-981-10-5903-2_124- 1977 280z ignition/fuel system "neutronics"
Provide some details about the car. Is it a California car with a converter or is it a Federal car without? There will be a sticker on the door jamb that says Catalyst or No Catalyst. I found the patent describing the concept. If the system follows the patent there will be some hardware attached to the air intake system after the AFM. Attached below. If it was mine I would disconnect it and get the wiring back to factory stock in order to simplify things until you get the engine started. There are numerous reasons that it might not be starting. Start with the basics - power to the coil, spark, tach signal, etc. Download the 1980 EFI book and do the electrical tests. Try starting fluid if you have spark. Make sure the fuel pump is working, etc... I'd also start a separate thread where everything you try is contained. Sometimes people start multiple threads and you can't tell what's been done. It can take a while to get things right after an EFI car has sat. https://patents.google.com/patent/US5163412A/en "Pollution control system for older vehiclesAbstractA pollution or emission control system for retrofitting on older vehicle engines includes a catalytic converter with an in-built oxygen sensor for mounting in the exhaust line, and a supplemental air input line containing a control valve for connection to the engine intake manifold to control the amount of air supplied to the engine. A computer monitors the oxygen sensor output and the engine speed, and controls opening and closing of the control valve according to the detected conditions. The computer also controls the speed at which the valve is opened or closed dependent on the engine speed and optionally the engine temperature, so that the valve can be closed faster at slower engine speeds and opened faster at higher engine speed. The computer is additionally capable of producing diagnostic telemetry, both digital and analog, to assist installation of the invention and test for proper operation once installed."- The OG 240Z - Reanimation Project
I would. But it will take me 35+ hours to get there. If I leave immediately. And break the speed limit.- '78 280Z Restoration - HLS30-436195
Here's a similar thread with good advice in it, linked below. Download the EFI Book from 1980 and run the electrical tests. Get actual resistance measurements at the ECU. Write them down and let us know what they are. Don't do the continuity tests and don't report any measurements as "good". If you want to save time. Check the vacuum hose to the fuel pressure regulator for fuel. It should be dry. Welcome to the 280Z EFI problem club. Good luck. https://www.classiczcars.com/files/category/4-manuals/- saturday night music thread
You've probably heard these songs but didn't know the artist. Same guy. He wrote one of them. Wahhh wah wah wah...- '77 280z running rich at idle, AFM screw doesn't work?
- '77 280z running rich at idle, AFM screw doesn't work?
- The OG 240Z - Reanimation Project
Are there any witness marks where the cover sat? Residual dust patterns? UV light bleaching?- '77 280z running rich at idle, AFM screw doesn't work?
- The OG 240Z - Reanimation Project
I don't want to be a buzzkill or a distraction or stir up a controvery if it's controversial - but why are you calling your car "him". I've noticed its use in some other places but I don't know where it came from. Is there a backstory? Seriously, I don't know, but it looks odd. I grew up with "her" or "she", which is probably not PC today, but "it" seems like the natural default. Anyway, good luck on the trip and the event. Should have made a "will it run and drive" video. There's still time for the "will it make it" part. A barn find with the dust still on it will probably draw more attention than the resto's.- '77 280z running rich at idle, AFM screw doesn't work?
Lean misses can cause rich exhaust. And California cars did have 02 sensors and catalytic converters through 1975 and up. Where did you get your car? Does it have a "Catalyst" sticker on the driver side door jamb? Looks like it has the proper AFM. Are the injectors original? Doesn't look like you pulled the vacuum hose the FPR to check for fuel. Pulling and inspection of each spark plug is worth doing, you might have a bad cylinder. Check and set valve lash, it's the first item in the Tuenup chapter. Check that your timing advance mechanisms are working correctly, both vacuum and mechanical. 16 is kind of high for idle RPM, the system is designed to retard timing at idle for cleaner exhaust by using ported vacuum timing advance. Check the charcoal canister to see if it's loaded with fuel, and check the operation of the control valve on top. Maybe somebody modified it and you're pulling intake air through the gas tank. The tiny things add up.- F4W71A Rebuild
If the problem is synchros grinding it might be worth a shot to try Pennzoil Synchromesh. If it's bearings that another story. If it's both try the Synchromesh to see if it stops the grinding and put in new bearings if you can't find the synchros. Some thoughts. You did say possibility.- My Listing: 1970 240z 4 Screw SU Carb Kit on eBay
Something's wrong with the first listing. Broken link. The $589 is "Buy it now" and the other is an auction, with three bids to $56. I don't know if EBay auctions have a reserve or not. I'd guess maybe the seller can just not complete the deal? From what I've seen, the way to set a reserve on eBay is to set the reserve as the minimum bid to beat. Maybe he forgot or doesn't know to do that. The $589 is $539 with a coupon.- F4W71A Rebuild
EuroDat has written a bunch about rebuilding transmissions. Here's one link from Tech Articles. The Resources area is really hard to get through, can't figure out where things are. Really just need a long clean list of every title in the area. Had to use Google to find it. There might be more out there. Search EuroDat's name.- Bronze valve seats?
Quite a blast from the past. Filling in the "rest of the story".- 240 Cyl heads
Random aside that might be relevant - there is also an N42 from the Maxima L24's. Some people call them MN42's. They have a cylinder head temperature sensor hole tapped in below and between the 5 and 6 spark plug holes. Still not correct for your car but could factor in to selling. Desirable for people looking to raise compression ratio on an L28.- '77 280z running rich at idle, AFM screw doesn't work?
Edited after coffee kicked in...strikethrough does not show in the snippet. The idle air screw only adjusts idle RPM, not the fuel-air ratio. It's difficult to lean out the mixture on the EFI engines. Hope that you find something wrong somewhere. Edit - sorry, just looked at your picture and see that you meant the AFM screw. One possible reason for a rich mixture is a leaking fuel pressure regulator. The diaphragm can crack and let fuel directly in to the intake manifold through the vacuum reference hose. Another possibility is a lack of the vacuum on the FPR vacuum port. A disconnected or cracked hose or a connection to the wrong vacuum port. The FPR reduces fuel pressure in proportion to intake vacuum. Check the hose for fuel to see if the FPR is leaking, and make sure it's connected directly to an intake vacuum source. Sticking injectors is a possibilty. A maladjusted AFM is a possibilty. Generally, the AFM spring should not be messed with. But sometimes it's too tempting. See if the glue blob on the adjustment wheel is intact. I had also found that my aftermarket AFM was set to run rich. I had to use an old original AFM to pass emissions inspection in Oregon.- Z Restoration Progam
I've already expressed that in posts above.- Z Restoration Progam
This thought has crossed my mind. It's already known that "conversations" with AI personas do that after many repetitions. The key to best use of AI is to read the references. The source material. The talk of cadmium on Z's is based on the history of cadmium on other Nissan cars. Pretty clear, you showed it yourself. Denial does not make that untrue. Are you saying that the people using the Checklist used zinc-plated parts even though the Checklist says Cad? What do you mean? That the Restoration program cars don't have cadmium-plated parts, or they do because the Restore shops followed the literal instructions and used cadmium? You're focused on a document again, and avoiding the possible reality. The main point of this discussion is "what really happened?". Are you saying that in 1996 the professionals restoring the 240Z's knew that "Cad" meant zinc? Add some clarity. I've been surprised that none of the experts, like @zspert have commented. Did you guys use zinc-plated parts or cadmium-plated parts? Don't worry about offending me, I'm just here to learn. If the Checklist said "Cad" and you took that as zinc, so be it. Or did you just send them to a plating shop and let them do whatever. That would settle one part of the Restoration cars question. Don't any of the Restore Shop pros have old documentation? The internet was supposed to save all information in electronic form. What is Grok learning from if all of this old truth is gone.- Artificial Intelligence And Automobiles
Kids raised on AI is a scary thought. Here's a glimpse of the future.- Z Restoration Progam
More interesting at this point might be what whoever wrote the Nissan Restoration Checklist meant by "cad". How do we find out who wrote that thing? Doesn't one of the "shop" guys have old correspondence? Email was a thing in 1996. I had a Eudora account. I wonder if they deferred to Wick Humble. Looks like he's still around. https://www.linkedin.com/in/wick-humble-784154133/ https://www.facebook.com/wick.humble/ - 1977 280z ignition/fuel system "neutronics"
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