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halz

speed cameras

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Mike mentioned Autralia's use of speed cameras in another post...don't get me started. They are termed "revenue raisers" nowadays and most state governments plan their yearly budgets to include a healthy few million $$ from these devices.

Interestingly, the powers that be contnue to quote statistics ad-nauseum about how the cameras have reduced the accident rate. As we who have befallen the speed cameras can tell them, the cameras only give an accurate picture on straight, flat, wide, open roads in good lighting conditions when there is only a single car in view. In other words, positive identifications of a car exceeding the speed limit can only be made in ideal (read: SAFE) driving conditions. So you may be tootling along at 65km/h in a 60 zone one fine Sunday morning all by yourself when *flash*, you are photographed. Your day will be spoilt because you know that in weeks time a fine will arrive in your mailbox for $135.00. If you try to contest the fine, Sergeant Bargearse, officer on duty at the time, will state that the camera was installed, tested and operating correctly (even though he was scoffing another pie and reading the form guide at the time- he's got a tough job!).

Now tell me they are not revenue raising.

In Western Australia, cameras are slightly differnent to the East. Cars can only be photographed from the front which means motorcycles (rear numberplate only) never get caught by cameras in the west.

Incedentally, in W.A. the cameras are called Multa-Novas, which leads to the popular saying:

"If you see a Multa-Nova,

cross the kerb and run it over!"

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In CA we have cameras at crucial/large/frequently run/on the list of top accident area intersections to catch left-turn-lane runners. Your front bumper trips a beam that is activated as the light turns RED. As the beam is broken, several high-tech cameras with flashes take pix of your car from several angles, including one with a very good telephoto lense of your face through the glass. You get a little letter in the mail and it costs you $270 a pop. Most major cities in CA are doing it now.

steve77

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You reckon that's bad.

London already has a huge car park called the M25. The south western portion has gantry's at about 1/2 mile distances. Each gantry has cameras that will (not yet though) take a picture of your number plate, a computer "reads" the plate and automatically updates the Police system that not only sends you a automated ticket but also lets you know that you have points on your license. The cameras are currently used to vary the speed of traffic during peak times. A speed display is shown to you have time to slow down...if you don't...yep... you've won a ticket. The government announced some time ago that it will tackle the increase in traffic on the roads by not building new roads but finding ways to get more traffic on the existing ones.....DOH....have you figured that out????

You can buy a map that shows you all the routes around the M25. These routes are now as slow as the M25...classic.

In London they are trying introduce a "fee" for using London roads. The major is going to use existing static digital speed cameras to take a picture of your plate. You are then "forced" to pay a fee (the amount is still to be advised) either by calling a phone number and quoting your credit card or over the net. Oh yes they are thinking of giving you 24 hours to make the payment before no doubt sending you a ticket.

Driving in London at peak times is a MAJOR PITA. They have to something about it and one of the pet hates of all motorised worldwide is watching tossers driving up the bus lanes at peak times only being forced to que back into the lane at the end....thus more delays. So what they put in cameras. The old type ran on film and they lasted all but 3 days. So now they have put in the new DSL linked cameras that will ALWAYS get you. Good I say. I hate waiting and queing.

The Westminister Council (runs the area around Big Ben and surrounding CBD) currently issues about £3million in parking tickets A YEAR..... A metered packing space costs £1 per 20 minutes in places. A public privately run carpark will charg you £25 to park for 8 hours....OHFG.

And what is the answer to all this.............anyone know??? You'd make a million if you knew how. Make 2 million if you could convince the bonehead Major that you were right.

Sorry, that's my little moan for the morning.

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IMO bus lanes are a complete waste of time and have contributed to more congestion and a bottle neck of traffic then ever before in London.

What about the M4 bus lanes as you reach London, no traffic and then bam bus lane! Stuck in traffic for hrs just to see a couple of taxis shoot past you every 5 mins... Wheres the sense in that??

We have the worst transport system ever, not only is it one of the most expensive in Europe but its useless too. It was discovered recently that temperatures on the London Underground exceeded what was safely legislated under an EU commision for the transport of animals!!

The moral of the story is that motorists hear get shafted any way possible; high fuel costs, crap roads, speed cameras, high road taxes, high parking fees etc... . Notice how the real issues arent being tackled.... like providing a cheap, reliable, clean public transport system...

The speed cameras here are a licence to print money and whats worse is that they dont put them in high risk places like near schools etc.... They install them on open roads, sometimes in non built up areas or on corners on a motorway where you'll have no chance of seeing them.

I'll get off my soap box now...

THANKS..

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In Western Australia, cameras are slightly differnent to the East. Cars can only be photographed from the front which means motorcycles (rear numberplate only) never get caught by cameras in the west.

Are you sure? That seems odd as here they can only take a picture from the rear. It's to do with a privacy issue or some other gibberish. Also that means over there they'd have to set up the camera further down the road than the speed gun surely??

Bus lanes are there to promote public transport. Use public transport - get to work on time. That's providing the bus wasn't delayed by something else...

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Camera Nazi's in NZ as well, heaps of mobile ones (you have to be really stupid to be done by the fixed ones). On the open roads they are allowed to hide in bushes.

I don't like the idea of not being able to try and sweet talk the officer out of a ticket.

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Alfaog I'm sure of it. the radar and camera unit are mounted together...usually hidden at the bottom of a long hill behind some shrubbery. Just to blacken your mood, about 50m past the radar they place a temporary sign which reads: "You have just passed a speed camera, thankyou for driving within the limit" Its enough to get the veins on the temple throbbing!

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If they are hidden in bushes, then casually pull to the side of the road, walk up to the bush and then relieve your self. LOL

Or just run the things over. I can't image that they'd be manned.

Just a few dilinquent thoughts roaming through my childish mind. I'll grow up now...

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Oh but they are 'attended' (see my original post). Usually by a fat copper reading newspaper and scoffing down a pie... So he might not notice the quick 'hotwash' you are suggesting!

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Have you seen the 'clear' license plate covers? They look clear, but have this prism or hologram type thing built into them. From straight on, they look normal, but at the angle of the cameras, they are totally blank. Pretty trick, but I wouldn't want to have one on my car if I got pulled over by an actual cop...

steve77

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I heard a story at uni once of someone unbolting and taking off with the speed camera while the Traffic Officer Slept in his car.

Don't know if it was true or not but it made for a good laugh.

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Alohas,

I've experienced traffic cameras in two States: Oregon and Hawai'i. In Oregon, they are only allowed to put them in residential areas where people are really concerned about cars exceeding the speed limit. You know, around schools, retired folks and such. Nobody in Oregon really tried to fight the cameras, so they stayed. However, I do know that it is the governments burden to provide the evidence that it is actually YOU driving the car. If they say you have to admit to speeding because they have a blurry picture of your car/you, then it is self-incriminating, which is un-constitutional. They have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that it is you in the car.

Here in Hawai'i, they were putting the cameras on the H-1, H-2 & H-3 freeways, and a couple other major roads. Very few of the cameras were near a residential area or schools, which made people livid, as they felt it was a complete revenue maker without any intention of making the roads safer. That being so, people down here protested at the state capital, wrote to their state legislators and told them "get rid of the cameras or we'll make sure you're out of a job." Well, needless to say, the department of transportation tried to usurp the authority of the legislature here and got their asses handed to them by the politicians who were afraid of losing their pathetic jobs. So, the cameras are banned in Hawai'i.

I honestly did not know that other countries had implemented the traffic cameras. It really makes me paranoid if governments around the globe are photographing their citizens in the name of "traffic safety." How can we be assured they are not taking our pictures ALL the time? I know you see a flash, but your basic 35mm camera can take pictures in broad daylight w/o a flash, so what's to keep a multi-million dollar piece of equipment from doing the same? Personally, I think its a breach of privacy and personal rights. The government has NO right to collect information on citizens without just cause. Even if they are collecting information behind our backs, I find it upsetting that when they do it before our eyes, nobody really does anything about it.

Just my $0.02

~Joel

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Oh yeah, almost forgot one more thing. In Oregon, the police were required to place a "highly visible, readable sign" about 50 meters ahead of where their camera van was located. They also had to have the parking lights turned on all the time. I think it was raised as a safety issue (although you know its to give the citizens a break), that ALL police that were setting speed traps had to have their parking lights on, as it would be the city/county/state's fault if for some reason their hiding a camera van or traffic cop resulted in an accident. I agree 100%.

I think here in Hawai'i, they didn't have to have their parking lights on, which some people were pushing for. I think a few people took advantage of the fact that they could say, "hey...I was going the speed limit when I took the turn, your van was un-marked and difficult to see, sorry if I scared him" as they 'buzzed the tower' so to speak.

~Joel

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Well at least they were reasonable about having the cameras visible hawaiiankine.

As halz was saying, here in Western Australia they hide the speed cameras. Usually in a place where the natural speed is a lot higher than the actual posted speed limit.

If thats not bad enough you can now get booked for 5km/h over the limit. They forced this on us while knowing that most car speedometers are only accurate to approximately 10%.

They then send you a fine thru the mail (you can pay over the phone by visa now - how convenient!). If you want to see the actual photo you have to pre-arrange to go into a cop shop and see it.

Still it gets worse - they then had the brain wave that they were driving their most profitable drivers off the road thru demerit points, once you get 12 demerits you are off the road for 3 months or so. So they doubled the fines and halved the demerit penalty for speeding offenses, thus increasing revenue.

In terms of driver attitude and law enforcement the damn things are absolutely meaningless. Everyone I know considers it to be "bad luck" to get caught by a speed camera.

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We have also speedcameras here in Finland. Usually these cameras are in some sequence of road. It can be for example some 50 km long sequence of road. There they have 10 or so camera posts in both directions. Normally there is only one camera that police moves from post to post. There are also signs to say that camera surveillance starts from here on. But they dont have to tell when it stops. Offcourse you know where this ends because the posts arent going to move.

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26ounce, you're right...and in case anyone ever bitches about speed cameras, don't even think of living in Australia! The cameras in Victoria now get you for doing 3km/h(!!) over the speed limit even though the ADR's (australian design rules) state that all speedos can be within 10% tolerance...contradiction itself! Not only that, but when the victorian government was deciding what to do with the money designated for 'black spots', they decided that putting the $25 million (!!!!) into speed cameras would be a better idea to help stop fatalities and accidents! If that isn't the stupidest thing I have ever heard!!! And (surprisingly...) the number of accidents and fatalities has not decreased according, or even at all, due to the speed cameras placed in our roads. The pigs now have unmarked vehicles of all makes and models (and ages) on the roads with speed cameras setup on the front bumper (about 40cm long, 25cm tall and a couple of cms thick), so all they have to do is park somewhere, eat donuts for a few hours and get some fines...no-one even knows that they're there..pisses me off...and it must be dangerous because everyone has to constantly keep an eye on their speedo!!...sorry bout the long message...

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Alohas,

That's horrible Leeroy. You think the policy makers would pull their heads out of their...well you know...and pay attention.

Here in the States, the way I follow what is being said about these contraptions, they are a breach of privacy and put the burden of proof on the accused (which is illegal in any prosecution case). I honestly think if people made a bigger complaint about the issue and organized to present a real

threat to the political survival of the policy makers, then a lot of these things would be taken off the road.

There are far safer means to control traffic speeds and red light runners, AND provide employment for humans instead of expensive cameras.

Then again...when a gov't sees $$...that's all they see.

~Joel

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Read a story in the paper a few months ago about this. A man in California received one of these notifications in the mail with a picture of his car exceeding the speed limit.

He takes a picture of Money on his table and sends it to them in an envelope.

A few days later he gets a reply and finds a picture of handcuffs in the returned envelope. LOL

We do not have these cameras in Florida yet but I am sure it is only a matter of time. Will have to find me one of those clear tags that hides your plate#.

:classic:

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The pigs now have unmarked vehicles of all makes and models (and ages) on the roads with speed cameras setup on the front bumper (about 40cm long, 25cm tall and a couple of cms thick), so all they have to do is park somewhere, eat donuts for a few hours and get some fines...no-one even knows that they're there..pisses me off...

Want to know something that will wizz you off even more? The guys sitting in the cars. They aren't cops. They are RENT-A-COPs. They are contract employees hired to set up the cameras and watch the money roll in.

They probably have some kind of .WAV audio file that sounds like a cash register bell going off every time the camera catches somebody. CHA-CHING! CHA-CHING!

Cameras are $80,000AUD. The unit sitting outside the car is a flash box. And, the camera itself sits inside the car.

I'd like to find some way of making an electronic device that blows the circuits out of those cameras as you drive by. Or, hell.. you can even buy transparent paint that reflects the flash back at the car... (put on your license plate frame).

I've got a friend in Vic who's a cop. ;) But, he's a real cop.. not a traffic dog.

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We have both here in Arizona, not too many speed cams though. But the red light cameras are going up like crazy. Both my wife and I got nailed by them 2 weeks apart. I don't mind paying a fine when I'm caught speeding or running a red light, my problem is that the tickets are not only outragous ($160 each) but OVER half the money goes to a private company that "maintains" the cameras.

I've been told that they reduce the yellow light time on lights with the cameras. I guess I need to take the video camera out and time it.

Come to think of it, If they aren't using the manpower to right the tickets, shouldn't the fines be cheaper.

D

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I think we need to start a group that is against speed cameras. A little black spraypaint and they have to send someone out to take care of it. Hell, a big enough pipe wrench and that sucker takes a fall. In Aus, just start a group that runs around taking the flash module that sits outside the car. Easy. All you have to do is trap some fat doughnut cop in the car. Or, hell.. wait for him to fall asleep.

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