Does anyone recognise these wheels?

[e_racer1999]

lovely works car..... anyway, i think those rims are very nice......... has anyone checked the japanese tuning books for fairladys?

[v12horse]

The first picture is the Data of a 73' 240ZR. I believe that it is a replica, but I am unsure. The description of the wheels is there, but it is in Japanese.

The second picture is referring to many pictures. Number 5 is what describes the wheel.

Can someone please translate these. I really need to learn Japanese.

Take care for now,

Ben

[e_racer1999]

my japanese is bad..... took me a few minutes to read the "engine" "suspension" and "wheels" portion!

[HS30-H]

Hi Eric,

Some excellent info there from Ben.

The four spoke wheels in your pic were indeed originally made by Kobe Seiko. KS made the original magnesium wheels for the 432R, the original 'Works' rally mags - which were never sold to the general public - the original Sports Option magnesium eight spokes for the 432R ( which were later offered for the HS30 ) and also these super-wide four spokes. They came in more than one size.

In Japan, these wide four-spokes have been called "Gotti" mags for a long time - although as far as I am aware they were not a direct crib of a Gotti design, and they were manufactured by Kobe Seiko exclusively for Nissan's Works race use. They even have the little Nissan 'hamburger' mark cast into them. "Gotti" might be a nickname linked to a design that they resemble, as Gotti is a famous wheel brand in Europe. They were not actually sold to the general public, but like most things in race use they mostly seem to be owned by private individuals these days.

The ones on the white ZG in your photo are in fact replicas. A short ( very short ) run of replicas was made a few years back by the owner of the car ( Ise san - who is a fellow member of Club S30 in Japan ) and they are unfortunately not fully tested and approved. He was recently putting together plan to manufacture a fresh limited-edition run of replicas, but the price is going to be enormous ( and I mean enormous ).

I've got some more detailed pics at home, so can send them to you when I get back to the UK. Today I'm also going to visit a friend in Japan that has a couple of original ex-Works sets - so I'll ask him a bit more about them.

Cheers,

Alan T.

[EricB]

As always Alan comes to the rescue... wow thanks for the great info. With such exclusivity I'll be happy to stick to my Watanabes only possibly swapping them out one day for the lighter "R" variant and/or something with a little bit more lip. Thanks again.

-e

[HS30-H]

Just to tie-up the loose ends on this thread:

I visited my friend in Japan who has a couple of sets of the four-spokes, and here is the explanation ( as far as we can understand the situation, that is ):

The four-spoke wheel design seen on some of the Works Sunnies and Cherries may well have originated from an original design by famed European wheel maker "GOTTI".

Either the first few sets, or a batch or whatever, were ordered from GOTTI and used on some of the Works race Sunnies or Cherries. When Nissan wanted some wider ones, they asked Kobe Seiko to forge some similar designs from Magnesium. These were then used on the later Works Sunnies and Cherries.

When Nissan wanted a super-wide wheel for the 240ZR and some of the later GT-Rs with very wide Overfenders, they again asked Kobe Seiko to forge some special wheels ( in two widths ) to their requirements. These were based on the designs that Kobe Seiko had manufactured at Nissan's request for the Cherry and Sunny.

That's the story as far as we can make out. Please note that its perhaps not the definitive version of events, and that where anyone is being accused of 'copying' you might get a different version of events! I'm happy to be put straight by anyone who might know better.....

I popped off a couple of shots of the wheels that my friend has in his workshop. For reference, I took a close-up of the Nissan 'hamburger' marks cast into one of the spokes.

Cheers,

Alan T.

[v12horse]

This is very interesting. Thank you for the photos Alan. I am curious to know what the four nubs on the rim function for. I have seen a few pictures of these wheels before and it seems like there were a few different types. Not just width differences, but the spokes were more square. I am not sure on this one. I will find some pics.

Alan, you mentioned that Nissan contracted out the wheels to be made to certain specifications by Kobe Seiko- is there a link to these wheels with the Century 20 wheels? I am not sure if I am getting this right. They look very similiar to the wheels that you have pictured, but they are not made of magnesium, the spokes are not as round, and there are no nubs. They may even be another type of Kobe Seiko. I will post pics, but I hate posting pics that I have not taken.

Take care,

Ben

p.s. I want to go to Japan.

[v12horse]

Here is a GOTTI wheel that looks very familiar to the fabled Kobe Seiko wheel, but it would be the other way around. We are going to get to the bottom of this. The hunt is on.

http://www.spitfire.amicale.com/jantes.php3?id=29

-Ben

[HS30-H]

I am curious to know what the four nubs on the rim function for.

Hi Ben,

They are 'stoppers'. They stop the outer tyre wall from sliding into the centre of the rim in the event of a puncture. With the 'stoppers', it enables the car to be driven back to the pits in the event of a puncture ( theoretically ).

When the tyre is mounted on the wheel, the 'stoppers' are backed off. When the tyre bead is seated, the 'stoppers' are wound in and the locknut is tightened.

Alan, you mentioned that Nissan contracted out the wheels to be made to certain specifications by Kobe Seiko- is there a link to these wheels with the Century 20 wheels? I am not sure if I am getting this right. They look very similiar to the wheels that you have pictured, but they are not made of magnesium, the spokes are not as round, and there are no nubs. They may even be another type of Kobe Seiko. I will post pics, but I hate posting pics that I have not taken.

I think you are thinking of the 'Z Sport' that were exclusive to 'Central 20' ( the company headed by ex Nissan Works driver Haruhito Yanagida ).

They are indeed very similar. My fellow club member Watanabe san has a set of these on his ZG, and he did tell me who they were cast by ( but I've forgotten - sieve head! ). I'll ask him again.

Here's a pic of Watanabe san's ZG wearing the Central 20 'Sport Z' wheels:

Cheers,

Alan T.

[v12horse]

Awe yes, Central 20. Thank you for clarifying that. Those are the wheels I was thinking of.

[e_racer1999]

those are all very handsome wheels, even a bunch of those GOTTIs are attractive....

[v12horse]

Alan, the Central 20 'Sport Z' wheels on your friend's ZG look like exact replicas of the wheels on the Z432R racer pictured in post 12 that I thought were made by KS. Is this car not a factory racer? A Sports car club of Japan car? I was thinking that it was a works car because it has all the right bits. I am going a little off topic here.

I am with you e-racer, those wheels are very handsome. I think the only Gotti wheel of those is that gold four spoke style one.

Regards,

Ben