Jump to content

IGNORED

A/C for '73, factory or dealer installed?


gogriz91

Recommended Posts

The main problem with these units was not the units themselves but rather the fact that the S30 was not designed for an ac system.

The evaporator unit was mounted such that the blower was forced to SUCK air through it. (not very efficient) Most modern units are designed to have the blower do what it was designed to do and BLOW air through the evap. unit.(mo effecient)

Now combine this with vent hoses that have diameters the size of softballs and it's like trying to fart thru the Holland Tunnel! :stupid:

I went rotory and replaced everything I could on my 72 and the best it would do was just keep me from sweating at highway speeds. Forget stop & go traffic...had to shut the damn thing off to keep from overheating. (Remember, we're talking Houston, TX in the summer!)

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I'm in the process of installing a 105 amp alternator and a Honda blower motor and I fgured the system might actually do a decent job provided there were no leaks. I just didn't want to carry the weight around and put the load on the engine to run it in stop and go traffic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you're still planning to pull the system, which I assume you are, then to answer your earlier question, YES you will need to seal the holes left in the firewall from the high and low pressure hoses.

I would try and find some type of rubber plug similar to the ones used in your floorboards. You might also check with a local company in your area that installs and works on AC units. They may have a plug designed just for that purpose.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The main problem with these units was not the units themselves but rather the fact that the S30 was not designed for an ac system.

As a matter of fact, the S30 was designed to incorporate an air conditioning system. The Factory was fitting a very comprehensive system right from the beginning of sales to the general public in late 1969.

Of course this was on Japanese home-market models, and not the HLS30U.

Whether it actually worked as well as some people would have liked is another ( different ) discussion.

Another interesting discussion might be whether the original Factory air conditioning system was not offered on the HLS30U because it was designed for an RHD configuration, and only an RHD configuration - which would be interesting..........

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can't speak for the aftermarket systems on the early S30 but my 78 has an aftermarket system with a center mounted evaporator. And like the factory systems in the 74-78 S30, the blower does blow through the evaporator. I use R414B which is knows in the trade as 'Hotshot' and my system will actually reach as low as 34 degrees at the center vents. It gets pretty hot here in So Cal too and I have had no overheating problems in either of my cars. The main thing is to get rid of the upright compressor, make sure you have a good fan, make sure everything is sealed like where the evap vents into the system and where the ducts connect. I wouldn't suggest converting the old systems (factory or aftermarket) to R134A. It runs at to high a pressure and will eventually kill the system. Might not be easy for the average Joe to get some of the R12 replacements, but like I said I'm EPA certified and can buy any kind of refrigerant. Through experimentation, I've settled on Hotshot since it doesn't cause and pressure related problems and both cars have been trouble free for over three years now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Alan, I don't see why that system wouldn't have worked on LHD cars. I doesn't appear that anything from the system is in the footwells nor would it interfere with the steering column regardless of what side it was on. It looks rather similar to the system that they started using here in 1974.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As a matter of fact, the S30 was designed to incorporate an air conditioning system.

What's funny is that when I was first writing my reply I had written "240Z", but changed it to S30 in an effort to be politically correct. I'll be more careful in the future or maybe that's what got me here in the first place.ROFL

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Stephen,

As far as I understand it ( certainly looking at the Factory parts catalogs for the LHD models ) the complete layout of the LHD heater system changed in July / August 1973.

Previous to July August 1973 the blower unit was under the RIGHT hand side of the dash on LHD models ( as opposed to the LEFT side of the dash on RHD models - as illustrated in the scan I posted ), and post July / August 1973 the blower ( and all its attachments ) moved over to the LEFT side of the dash - just like the RHD models.

Am I right?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hey Alan,

I believe post July / August 1973 the blower remained on the right side of the dash in the LHD models.

It is interesting that they had a system designed for the S30, yet they waited until 1974 to offer virtually the same system in the 260Z to the U.S. market.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hey Alan,

I believe post July / August 1973 the blower remained on the right side of the dash in the LHD models.

That's not what I see in the Factory parts catalogs for the LHD models.

Look at these two scans. First is 'up to July '73', second is 'From August '73'.

Blower motor and Intake Duct etc clearly moves from the left side of the dash to the right in July / August 1973 on LHD cars.

Please tell me I'm not going nuts..........

post-2116-14150796768179_thumb.jpg

post-2116-1415079676857_thumb.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Boy Alan, I don't know what to tell you.

I've never owned those particular models, but I've been a junkyard dog for 30+ yrs, scavaged thru hundreds of Z's and I don't ever recall seeing a LHD with the blower motor on the LH side. Seems like it would get in the way of the pedals.

Have you seen a RHD with the blower on the RH side?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well Alan, I don't know what to say either other than I've never seen a LHD S30 with the blower motor on the left. I must be dyselxic because I didn't notice the blower motor was on the left in your earlier scan. I was looking at the other components in the system. As far as the other scans, the one that is post July/August 73 has me confused. Here is one from one of my manuals that depicts the system in a 1974 US LHD 260Z.

post-3797-1415079676893_thumb.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Alan, I don't see why that system wouldn't have worked on LHD cars. I doesn't appear that anything from the system is in the footwells nor would it interfere with the steering column regardless of what side it was on. It looks rather similar to the system that they started using here in 1974.

Well, it looks to me as though the original Japanese market system would not be a 'bolt-in' fit to the first LHD cars. The heater casing of the pre-August 1973 LHD cars has its inlet duct on the right, the fan housing is on the right and the air intake from the cowl is also on the right. The LHD cars would therefore need their own design of air conditioning components rather than sharing the Japanese market parts.

I've never owned those particular models, but I've been a junkyard dog for 30+ yrs, scavaged thru hundreds of Z's and I don't ever recall seeing a LHD with the blower motor on the LH side. Seems like it would get in the way of the pedals.

Well, the illustrations I scanned and posted above are from the June 1974 issue Factory Parts Catalog for the 'Datsun 260Z. 240Z, model S30 series, USA & Canada' ( Nissan Pub. No. C-001OU ).

Section 27 ( 'Car Heater up to July '73' ) has 5 pages of illustrations showing the inlet duct and fan housing on the right.

Section 27A ( 'Car Heater from August '73 ) has 7 pages showing the inlet duct and fan housing on the left.

The same manual also has the ( new for August '73 ) Air Conditioner system illustrations in Section 29 ( three pages on the interior components ) and these all show the inlet duct and fan housing on the right........

Does this mean that the illustrations in Section 27A are actually wrong?

Have you seen a RHD with the blower on the RH side?

No, but then why would it ever need to be?

Well Alan, I don't know what to say either other than I've never seen a LHD S30 with the blower motor on the left. I must be dyselxic because I didn't notice the blower motor was on the left in your earlier scan.

I mentioned it because I thought it might be significant. I saw the illustrations showing the - apparent - movement of the air duct and fan housing right at the date the Factory air con system was phased in on the LHD models.

As far as the other scans, the one that is post July/August 73 has me confused. Here is one from one of my manuals that depicts the system in a 1974 US LHD 260Z.

All of this would be easy to put to rest straight away if the illustrations in section 27A of the parts catalog are incorrect. I've seen a few little mistakes in other Nissan parts catalogs and workshop manuals for the S30-series Z, but this one is a biggie and I've never seen any reference to it.

But going back to my original point - the Japanese market got the option of an air conditioner system designed for the ( RHD layout ) car and it was available right from the beginning of sales in late 1969. The USA & Canada market on the other hand ( a market that included territories where I would have thought an air con system was de rigeur ) did not get this until August 1973.

In the meantime - ie from early 1970 to late 1973 - some dealers and private owners in the USA were fitting aftermarket air con systems to their cars. That's a long time. Especially when the Japanese market ( which gets very hot and humid in Summer ) had a perfectly good system designed for the car and available Factory-fitted as a specifiable option.

Surely it would have been simple for Nissan to incorporate a Factory-fitted air con system into the LHD cars from the beginning of production? Why didn't they do that? I have my own theories, but I'm interested to hear what anybody else thinks.

Alan T.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wasn't the cost a large consideration when Nissan started building cars for the US? If I recall correctly the base price here was $3526 when the 240Z was introduced here in 1969. Optioning them out with things like a/c, power steering, etc. surely would have raised the selling price.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally Posted by HS30-H

The heater casing of the pre-August 1973 LHD cars has its inlet duct on the right, the fan housing is on the right and the air intake from the cowl is also on the right. The LHD cars would therefore need their own design of air conditioning components rather than sharing the Japanese market parts.

So other than screwing up and saying S30 as opposed to 240Z, I was correct in the spirit of the thread that the 1973 HLS30, the original topic of discussion, was not designed for AC.

Originally Posted by HS30-H

Does this mean that the illustrations in Section 27A are actually wrong?

My guess is that the wrong illustration/s got sent to the printer.

Originally Posted by HS30-H

Surely it would have been simple for Nissan to incorporate a Factory-fitted air con system into the LHD cars from the beginning of production? Why didn't they do that? I have my own theories, but I'm interested to hear what anybody else thinks.

I would be interested to know the answer also, however, until someone who was there and involved in the decision making process enlightens us, we'll all just be speculating until we're blue in the face and we'll still not know for sure.

Hey, isn't it time for some of you 8/73 & up 260Z owners to pipe in here and shed some light on the subject?

Jump in, the waters fine.ROFL

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 year later...

I have the same aftermarket A/C system for my late 73' 240Z. If Datsun Z Guy doesn't want to keep his system I would like to buy it for my Z. I have the "how ya doin" box and the hoses, but I am missing the compressor, dryer, etc etc. I am debating about going with the "factory system or the company vintage air or something similar to them. In south Ga air is a must. Has anyone ever put a vintage air system on their 240Z?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hullo All

Some of the discussion here refers to Factory Air Conditioning. My 1973 JDM Fairlady 240Z-L was ordered in July 1973 by an Australian lady working in Japan at the time. I have the original brochure the lady used to select the car. The lady obtained an "Estimate" (Quote) from Nissan to supply the car including: "a set of tools, a spare tire, a set of service kit, a set of floor mats and an air conditioner"

The quoted cost for the air conditioner was 200,000 Yen.

Unfortunately for me the lady decided not to include the air conditioner in the final Order for the car. I am unsure if cost was the issue.

The Factory certainly offered Air Conditioning as an Option on the JDM vehicles.

I hope this helps the discussion.

Regards, Jack

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

Stephen

I am ahving my 1970 240Z HLS3003435 restored and want to add a good A/C system. It had the ARA system shown in this thread but I want to change from the R12. Any suggestions on a system that will work well since I'll be driving in Al where it gets reat hot!

Pictures of the restoration can be seen at rodshopofmemphis.com site.

Thanks, Wally

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, there's the Vintage Air system. They're a bit pricey but they are the best system I've ever experienced. They are designed to use R134A. They cool the car down fast like a modern OEM system. The drawback for you would be that they use their own controls which would be a problem if originality or at least the appearance of originality is a concern. The main drawback of ARA system in the earler cars, as mentioned before, is that it sucks the cold air from the evaporator rather than blowing the cold air through it. The factory systems and the later ARA type systems like the one in my 78 as well as the Vintage Air system have the evaporator mounted in the center, behind the control panel rather than in the passenger footwell.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Stephen, Thanks. Originality is not a driving factor. I want the car as near to original as possible but I plan to drive it so I want comfort where possible. I'll look at the Vintage systems.

Regards

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here's another after-market site: www.hotrodair.com. I think their system will go into the S 30. It replaces the heater core and provides a/c in one compact unit. Their parts are available individually. I'm going to do some research on this and see if it will fit. I have one of their catalogs and the only problem I can see (other than the complete tearout of the dash) is going to be fabricating up a mounting bracket for the compressor. I think that mounting it on the left side of the motor makes the most sense. I'm pretty sure that is where the factory units were mounted in the 260s and 280s. If anyone has a left side mount they would be willing to part with please send me a pm. Cheers, Mike

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks, the ARA unit I removed looked like the one pictured in gogriz91's thread on 2/11/06 mounted on the passenger side of the engine. Since the dash will be out for the restoration it will not be a problem.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and Guidelines. We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.