Mike

Yep, you can edit your own messages. Just click on the EDIT button on the bottom right of the message when you're viewing it. It will then ask you if you want to keep or re-upload a new image.

Alphadog, As a moderator, I think you can edit the message. You can save that image to your local hard drive, resize it, and then edit his message (inserting the smaller graphic). Some people don't know how to modify images like this and they will post the size directly from their camera. Anyway, it's worth a shot. I can do it if you don't have a program.

Ahh.. we thought maybe you ran over someone.

Matt, That's a good place to begin. I would also consider buying a Haynes, Nissan, and Chiltons Zcar manuals. They all cover for each other in one way or another. (warning aimless plug) Also don't forget the Zcar Microfiche CD. If you're gonna order parts or need diagrams to work from in your garage, this is a MUST HAVE. Just click HOME and select Microfiche CD from the main menu. You might want to make sure you also have a warm garage to work in with a good stereo.

You want to know the funny part... I don't think your car needs to meet emission standards anymore. It might be exempt from the law. Something changed last year (or early this year) in CA which lets a lot more Z owners rip off their emission equipment. You'll have to check with some of the Z owners to see if this is true for the 260z also. Or, at least find a link.

Here's a cool message posted to our mailing list by one of the members when I asked about rally racing: Mike, because there are so many different types, saying you're interested in rallying is almost as wide open as saying you're interested in racing. It ranges from a small group of enthusiasts on a poker hand tour to the madness of the WRC. I'll try to briefly sort out those found in North America. Terminology may differ in your area. For more info go to SCCA.org Gimmick rallies - usually pretty low key events, paved roads, relaxed speeds, easy navigation and non-critical timing. Often put on with a gimmick or theme. ie: Checkpoints at graveyards or apple orchards, maybe starting with a poker hand and drawing a new card at each checkpoint. or, answering a list of questions with the answers found along the route. No special equipment required. TSD Tour Rallies - (time-speed-distance) 2 -12 hours long, legal speeds, mostly paved roads, easy navigation, milaged route instructions, timing more critical, classes based on experience. no special equipment required but top finishers will be using computers with an integrated odometer. Many Vintage Rallies run under this format. I'm guessing this might be what you're looking for, or a good place to start. TSD Trap Rallies - 2 - 6 hours long, legal speeds, paved or paved and unpaved, navigation more difficult, route instructions like a puzzle, critical timing. lower classes sun SOP (seat of pants), upper classes run computers. (I personally get frustrated and lost on these, however my older brother is fanatic of these events.) Performance or Brisk TSDs - 3-12 hours long, brisk but legal speeds, paved and unpaved roads, easier navigation (sometimes with milaged tulip diagrams), most competitors run computers, some additional safety equipment may be required. these often run at night so additional lights could be handy. Rallycross - in North America this is an autocross on an unpaved surface, gravel pits and dirt speedways are popular places to hold these. In our local events all runs are scored and winners have the lowest total time. A spin or a bunch of pylons on one run can really put you out of the running. Think of those cones as trees! Classes are based on prep, drivewheels (2 or 4) and engine displacement. Like autocross, an sa 95 helmet is required. SCCA ClubRally - 4-8 hours legal speeds on transit sections, all-out speed on closed off stages, mostly unpaved, milaged tulip navigation. full safety prep (cages,harnesses, seats, suits etc.), beefed up suspensions, skid plates, classes based on prep, drivewheels (2 or 4) and engine displacement. Regional points championship. A 240Z should be real competitive in Group 2 if it's well prepared and driven. I did one of these in a rented SAAB and gained a great deal of respect for those drivers at the top. SCCA ProRally - 1-2 day events, The next step up, national pro series, 9 events, national points championship. Evos, WRXs and Team Libra Huyundai Tiburons rule supreme. SCCA is trying to make this a manufacturer showcase so, even though a 240Z is allowed in the rules, they'd rather see you in a more current ride. WRC - (World Rally Championship) not in North America yet, we should have one here in the next 2-5 years. When it gets here I'll be there to watch. This is the best of the best. Homolgation rules for the WRC will keep the new Z out as cars competing for manufacturers championship must be available as a 4-door. Mike (slow night at work) Winker IZCC 7308 Z Owners of Minnesota Comic/Ozzie Auto Sports Team '70 240Z RSR (Race Street Rally - wannabe) '93 Mitsubishi Diamante Wagon (Family Truckster Elegante')

Yes! Please post pics of this thing! I want to see the side pipes. I saw them only ONCE on a car at a local burger joint. Looked pretty good. I always wondered how a conversion like that would work-out on a Z. You know, by posting this message, you have volunteered to post pics. We won't let you sleep at night until there's at least two pics up here.

Alfadog, You're probably speaking about AU dollars, right?! Is the exchange rate still roughly 2 AU for 1 US? And, what's the market like down there? A lot of Aussie Zed owners?

What the heck is that sticking out of the front of the car?

So, what's up with the black hood? How did that become a color scheme for rally ? Did someone make this popular when they couldn't manage to finish painting their car before the race ? How did this fad start?

Great links! Thank you. It is surprising to see how well the Z can do in rally. Starting as an amateur could work very well with a Z. It's a cheap car, easy to work on, and is a great performer.

Ya, it seems to me that the Zcar might be too heavy for sufficient rally results. The little Toyotas, Hondas, and Peugeots will probably run circles around it. But, I don't know for sure... that's why I asked here.

Hiya Gus, Looks like you've figured out how to add a picture to your name field on the left side of the messages! Good job! If that's the Z you're talking about... yes, it does look like it's ready for rally.

Ya, I wouldn't run any kind of race w/out floorboards. That would be nuts. What if you slipped and your foot hit the ground? No way....:eek:

Here's a link to a video from Speedvision. It's about 18MB, so, better have a fast connection. I also paused it once it started playing to let the video load all the way. Anyway, awesome video compilation with music by Linkin Park. http://216.149.233.131/files/movie/wrc-high.wmv (looks like that link no longer works )

Anyone on this board into rally racing? I've been watching it on Speedvision a lot lately. I've always been into racing, but, this looks like it would be a lot more challenging than a standard race. I'm interested in it, where do I start looking and who do I talk to? I'm really interested in the Zcar aspect of it.

Well, your mistake was buying the extra strength bolts. Those aren't necessary on an aluminum head. The aluminum is a lot softer metal. And, you over-torqued the bolt. Take a look at a manual and try to find the right torque setting for that particular bolt. In fact, someone here might be able to help you out. Anyone got the torque setting for this application? As far as re-threading it, you should be in good shape with the aluminum head. Just make sure you get a good set of tools and take it slow. Also take care not to get metal shavings into your engine.

Is it safe to use teflon tape on your Z? I could see how it might not be safe on critical elements of the car. Sure, it works on plumbing, but, is it safe to use it on a flywheel bolt or something critical like that? A header might be a different story because it's not moving a hundred miles an hour. But, I'm just wondering about the safety of teflon tape used in these situations... Any ideas?

Cliff, When working on a Z, it's best to have at least 3 manuals lying around. I've had many situations where one manual conpensates for anothers lack of information. And, it's also a good way to verify that the information contained within the manual is correct. I seem to remember shearing a bolt because of an incorrect torque parameter. I consulted another manual and found out that my original setting was off .... Haynes, Chiltons, Nissan Shop Manual, and of course, the Zcar Microfiche CD!

, Wayne Burstein wrote (alot, but I'm addressing just one point): >I am wondering why you are going to coilovers in a street car. Racers >use them to be able to raise and lower the car, and particularly to set >corner weights. Setting corner weights lets each wheel do the maximum >work keeping the car hooked up in corners. The only reason I would see >for using coilovers in a street car is for someone who wants to change >ride heights -- possibly lowering the car for autocross or track >events. Well, there are a few more I can think of: 1) You want to put wider wheels and tires one, but not flare the fenders. By using coilovers, you can use more backspacing in the rear and put wider wheels on. In fact, you can put a 17x9 wheel on with 255/45-17 tires if you use just the right backspacing, 8 inch coilovers, etc. 2) You want to try different spring rates with a wide selection. Once the coilovers are one, you can swap in springs in rates that vary by 25 lb/in over a wide range. 3) One unforeseen benefit is that you no longer need a spring compressor to change springs, etc. Just lower the spring perch to unload the spring and disassembly can begin. 4) The prices for coilovers have come down. I paid a pretty penny to Carerra for mine, but you can get them cheaper at places like http://fonebooth.com . I see more and more people going to coilovers for reasons 1, 2, and 4 above. BTW, use the search function on HybridZ.org on this topic. There is alot of good info posted there on coilovers. Regards, - Pete Paraska <pparaska@home.com> <http://members.home.net/pparaska/> IZCC#15 73 240Z under marathon body restoration, V8 swap, suspension & brake mods Check out HybridZ.org for Datsun Z cars modifications, no holds barred! ------------------------------------ Internet 240z Club - http://240z.org

This message was posted to the list by Wayne Burstein. I thought it needed to be captured and put into our database permanently. Mitch asked about coilovers on a street car (including shortening the struts and how to get a compliant suspension): Let me address that in two parts. First, getting a suspension that performs well in a street car, but is not too stiff is not particularly easy. In a Z that is driven daily, I would recommend lowering the car less than an inch to avoid problems with speed bumps, etc. Also, I would recommend keeping the springs/struts fairly soft and running stiff sway bars. That keeps the ride acceptable but minimizes body roll in corners. If you want a race car type of suspension, expect to feel every pebble on the road (that is what I want on my street car, but it is not a daily driver). It is very important to get the right springs and dampers (strut cartridges in the case of a Z). Basically, you want to match the springs and struts. The springs do the work of holding the car up and allowing the wheels to react to bumps in the road. The dampers are there to keep the springs from bouncing the car up and down for a long time after hitting a bump. If the dampers are too weak, it is like the old commercials for worn out shocks -- the car does not quickly settle after hitting a bump. Too stiff dampers keep the springs from doing their job and the car reacts to the bumps instead of the wheel moving up and down in relation to the car. I am wondering why you are going to coilovers in a street car. Racers use them to be able to raise and lower the car, and particularly to set corner weights. Setting corner weights lets each wheel do the maximum work keeping the car hooked up in corners. The only reason I would see for using coilovers in a street car is for someone who wants to change ride heights -- possibly lowering the car for autocross or track events. And even this use brings into question how you would re-align the car every time you changed the ride height. Maybe you could come up with some kind of compromise alignment that would work for both ride heights? I am a little concerned about your comment that your current suspension is too stiff, but bottoms frequently. Suspension dampers are not designed to handle frequent bottoming and you should fix this problem. A couple of years ago I posted a fairly long explanation to the IZCC list about shortening struts and the trade-offs that need to be made. Here it is: Let's start by defining the task at hand. We want to lower the car in order to lower the center of gravity. I'll skip all the analysis on why we want to do this because there are lots of good books on the subject, and confine my comments to what you might run into in performing this on a Z. First I need to define a couple of terms: Bump -- suspension travel in the compression direction (i.e. the result of hitting a high spot in the road). Rebound -- suspension travel in the opposite direction (i.e. the result of going over a hill and the wheels leaving the ground). The first problem we run into is that when we shorten the springs, we are reducing the available bump travel in the strut cartridges by the same amount we lowered the car. With all the travel available in a stock Z, this is not too much of an issue when we lower the car only an inch or so. For those of us who are racing our cars, we often lower them much more; for instance, in the SCCA's IT class, we are allowed to lower the car until the rockers are no lower than 5" above the ground. This causes a problem because the suspension is almost fully compressed when the car is sitting at rest. When you hit a bump, the suspension quickly bottoms out (hopefully on a bump stop of resilient material). This is a real problem because in effect, the spring rate increases very dramatically and negates all of our efforts to drive the car smoothly. When driving at or near the limit, this often is the beginning of a very impressive crash. Well, we now have the car at the desired ride height, but need to increase the travel in bump. The way to do that is to shorten the struts. Now things get pretty messy. Don was correct in stating that this is dependent on the length of the struts; however, this is only partly true. The struts need to be long enough to insert the cartridges of choice. For racing, the ones that I would recommend are Carerra, Koni, or Tokico, in that order ( this should cause a bit of discussion on its own). If we automatically shorten the strut to exactly fit the cartridge, we might actually shorten it too much. This leaves us without adequate rebound travel. Just in case this does not scare you, it should. I learned my lesson the hard way when I had the rear wheels pick off the ground while cresting a hill that had a slight turn to it. That made for a looooong full lock slide at 100 MPH! Ok, now we need to decide just how much we want to shorten the strut housing. The desired end result is to have about equal bump and rebound travel. In other words, when the car is sitting at rest, we want the struts half way compressed. On a street car, this is fairly easy to do, because we generally set the car up once and never play with it. Race cars are another situation entirely. First of all, different tires require different ride heights -- for instance, switching from 60 series to 50 series tires lowered my car by .75", causing me to have to raise the car by the same amount. We also play with spring rates, and assuming that we are using coil overs, need to keep the spring collar low enough on the strut housing to avoid it interfering with suspension travel. The bottom line is that before cutting anything off your struts, you should carefully think about what you anticipate doing to the car over the next few years as far as tire/wheel, strut, spring or ride height changes, and then come up with a compromise that works for you. FWIW, most people shorten struts 1-2". If you figure out that you want to go more than this, recheck everything before cutting. Yes, you can add a section, but speaking from experience, it is much easier to remove than to add. I almost forgot to mention this, but if your strut housing is longer than the cartridge, you need to put a spacer below the cartridge inside the housing -- typically, these are just pieces of tubing that is slightly smaller in diameter than the inside dimension of the housing. Just a couple of tips to consider: 1) The best way I have figured out to cut the struts is to use a large pipe cutter. This gives a fairly straight cut with minimal cleanup -- you need to grind the burr off the inside of the housing and bevel the outside edge before welding them together. Be careful not to make the cut so high on the strut that you hit the threads for the gland nut! 2) To remove the original spring perch, the quickest way I have found is to cut through it just above the housing with a grinder or cut-off tool, and then grind the remaining metal off. I found it much easier to do this before cutting the strut because even though I was not cutting the section with the perch off, it did interfere with the cutter. 3) After lowering the car, you need to align the suspension because you have added negative camber at both the front and rear wheels. Of course, you should probably do this any time you remove suspension components anyway. Finally, Carerra was of invaluable help to me in figuring out what to do and how to accomplish these modifications, as well as supplying many of the parts I used. You can reach them at: 770-451-8811 Sorry to be so long winded, but this is a fairly complicated task to plan and implement without too much trial and error. Wayne Burstein WDCR SCCA ITS #10 IZCC #214, NVZCC wburstein@mountainmotorsports.net www.mountainmotorsports.net

Thanks for the compliments on the Z. And, thanks for the links! If you give us a TON of links, I'll give you a Zcar Microfiche CD. Can you find at least 40-50 links? If you are having a hard time, try to visit other Z sites and look at their link areas. [m]

So, you wanna post a pic of your ride? Go for it. We wanna see it. Just a few rules. 1) Max image size = 640x480 2) Picture Resolution = Any (but please resize to 640x480) 2) Color Depth = Any 3) Compression/format = JPEG or JPG preferred You can either supply a link to your picts from other sites within the message. Or, you can also attach a file to the end of separate messages. To post more than one pic of your car, submit one message and then post the rest as REPLIES to your original message. 3) Give us good descriptions! We need to know what we're looking at. 4) JPG images will show up in the messages. Other formats will only show up as "click to see" links.

Pic

Well, here's a pict of my Z as it still sits. I'm working on getting to the restoration progress again. I just had to buy a house. Damn.