HS30-H

26th-Z - I'll accept the apology on behalf of all REAL HS30-H models living and dead :classic: I'm not trying to score points off anyone - just trying to get verbal and anecdotal history to match up with reality. This site has a very good standard ( compared to many other Z related sites ) and its worth looking after that. 26th-Z might I suggest that you ask the opinion of somebody with first-hand experience of the ZG model - if there is anything in particular that you want to know about them - rather than that of somebody who seems to regard the RHD models as "irrelevant" Nissan only made the HS30-H model from late 1971 to late 1973, and it was indeed only in 2-seater form. Nissan showed a 2by2 model - with the full G-Nose panels - on a showstand once, but then decided not to go ahead with the model in that spec. If you see one with a 2-litre engine ( and an "S30" VIN prefix ) then its not a Factory-built ZG. Likewise, but slightly more difficult to weed out, many G-Nose panels and Overfenders have been attached to "HS30" VIN prefixed cars ( the correct VIN prefix ) but if any of these did not leave the Factory as a true ZG model then simply bolting the panels ( real or not ) onto a car will NOT make a Factory ZG. There are lots of ways to tell a REAL one from a fake or a replica, and you have to look at a lot of details to come to a final conclusion. Unfortunately, broadcasting these tell-tales tends to help fakers pass off their vehicles as the real thing - so I won't. It has sometimes been possible to find cars that left the Factory as ZG models - but which later ended up losing their G-Nose and Overfender panels ( due to damage or other factors ). Despite the fact that they look like 'normal' bodied HS30 models, these cars ARE still Factory ZG's. If you can't get your head round that - just think of Michael Jackson. He's still the same person as that little kid who sang "ABC" - but he doesn't look like him............. I get a cold chill down the spine when I see the famous ex-Mr K. yellow Z described as a "ZG". This is a good example of the difference between a nose job and Z au naturelle. If I put a false moustache and glasses on, and stick a large cigar in my mouth, it does not make me Groucho Marx.................. Alan T.

Come on 26th-Z, I expect better of you than that! A GS31 with an aftermarket copy G-Nose on it does NOT get the right to be called a "ZG". Only true Factory-built HS30-H models can be called "ZG", and in fact even if you took the G-Nose and Overfenders OFF of a ZG it would still be a ZG. Only the Factory could create a true ZG. This car looks like many thousands of cars that are still lurking in the rural areas of Japan. A modified GS31 like this would not be all that expensive either. And if this guy has a '72 with 432 headers then it must be SERIOUSLY modified. The S20 engine has different exhaust port size, shape ( round ports ), spacing and stud holes to the L-series engine - so a 432 header would NOT fit. He's probably just got a Japanese market 'taco ashi' ( Octopus leg ) manifold that he thinks sounds a bit more glamorous if he links it to the 432. Believe me - they DO NOT fit. I have both and they are NOT interchangeable................ Painting black and white stripes on a pony does not make it a Zebra. Come on guys - this is the best Z-related site on the web. Lets keep the standards up. Alan T.

Here's a close-up of the 432 Kobe Seiko magnesium wheel:

Ed & 2Many, The "Proto-2" pic I posted for comparison with the crash test car was actually just a mock-up. If you look carefully, you will see nothing ( no hub, no axle ) holding the rear wheel onto the car - its just standing there.Yes, Ed. The dark shadow that you see is a prop or stand that is probably the only thing holding the rear off the ground. Well spotted. Bumper guards do look larger than the final versions too. I don't think this is a 'clay' - I think its a little more than that - but its not really a rolling shell either. Its obviously quite a fair way before they finalised quite a few details - but getting very close to the finished shape. I have the date of the photo somewhere and I should dig it out the original again to find it.......... Did I read somewhere in an interview with Matsuo san that he initially wanted to make the whole front wing ( fender ) in one piece with the 'sugar scoop' headlamp surround incorporated into it? Can't remember where I saw that - possibly in an old Japanese magazine article. Anyway, I think I remember him saying that it could not be productionised that way and it took quite a lot of effort to get the sugar scoops made. I think this was the reason that they were initially made from FRP, and then later on they were able to make them successfully in steel. The 'sugar scoops' are a pretty complicated shape.............. 2Many - those are interesting points about the MVSS etc. Now I'm wondering what crash-tests would have been necessary for other markets. Maybe some markets like the UK would have accepted the Japanese crash test results. I was also thinking that LHD and RHD cars would probably perform fairly differently from eachother in crash testing. Food for thought? I have one of the Kobe Seiko 432 mag wheels that I will be using as the 'spare' on my 432R replica project. I can take a photo of it if you are interested. I also have 6 of the genuine Works "Rally" mags made by Kobe Seiko - which are slightly different in detail but essentially a similar design. In the mid Seventies Kobe Seiko marketed a very similar design wheel to the 432 mag and called it the "Maglloy". They crop up from time to time in Japan. If you are interested in Nissan wheel DNA, then the links between Kobe Seiko and Nissan are very interesting. Kobe Seiko made most of Nissan's race and Sports Option wheels before the mid-Seventies, and there was a design used from mid 1973 that harked back to those wheels designed by Matsuo san on the "Proto 2" photo car. Here's a picture of one. They were SUPER wide: Alan T.

Hi Kats, Great photo! I presume that your photo is of either a full production-spec. car - or something very close to it. It certainly looks very close to a production spec - even down to the emblems. Its clear that the Factory would have been conducting crash-tests right through pre-production, but possibly well into production too? I wonder how many cars they tested, and whether these bodies were assigned full VIN numbers? Fascinating! Alan T.

and here's a BLUE 432 outside at the same event. Note its not road-registered yet:

Hi Kats, Great photos you posted - as usual! That's very interesting about the November 25th press road-tests. I presume that this was the beginning of most of the press reports and road tests that started to appear in the December 1969 and January 1970 Japanese matoring magazines? There was a press-preview event in early October 1969 -before the Tokyo Motor Show - where members of the press were invited to look at some cars wasn't there? They could not drive them - and most of them were displayed indoors ( with a 432 and one other model - the "Export" car? outside ). It seems that these press-preview cars were DIFFERENT cars again to the ones that they got to test-drive in November. That's interesting. They were using quite a few different cars for these events. Here's a picture of a Fairlady Z ( base model ) at the Press Preview event:

For the HGS130, Manual transmission = 3.7:1 Automatic transmission = 3.545:1 Can I recommend that you invest in this book: "DATSUN / NISSAN 280 / 300 ZX" - By Brian Long ISBN: 1-901295-06-0 Published by VELOCE PUBLISHING PLC You won't find another book that covers ALL market models so comprehensively, and his understanding of the Japanese domestic market models is particularly good - which is going to help you in your particular situation. The other book I would recommend to you is the Factory Service Manual for the S130 models. This will not be cheap - but it will SAVE you money in the long run. Buying books is an INVESTMENT. "Books and tools, books and tools, books and tools". Should be a mantra for all of us. Alan T.

Can't tell you what the specs should be unless you tell us the VIN prefix..................

Maybe its a Fairlady because it was born that way. If its badged as a "Fairlady Z" that is because it was probably originally made for the Japanese domestic market. If you check out your VIN number ( the full number - including the prefix ) you will be able to get pretty close to identifying what exact model it is: *FAIRLADY Z ( S130S ) - L20E engine *FAIRLADY Z-L ( S130 ) - L20E engine *FAIRLADY Z-T ( S130J ) - L20E engine *FAIRLADY Z 2 by 2 ( GS130S ) - L20E engine *FAIRLADY Z-L 2 by 2 ( GS130 ) - L20E engine *FAIRLADY Z-T 2 by 2 ( GS130J ) - L20E engine *FAIRLADY 280Z-L ( HS130 ) - L28E engine *FAIRLADY 280Z-T ( HS130J - BC ) - L28E engine *FAIRLADY 280Z-L 2 by 2 ( HGS130 ) - L28E engine *FAIRLADY 280Z-T 2 by 2 ( HGS130J - BC ) - L28E engine I'm curious as to why you stated "Import Car Of The Year" - is that on a sticker or emblem attached to the car? Seeing as the Fairladies were not imports, I'm wondering whether this was attached later ( and not at the Factory or the original dealership that sold the car ). Also - where are you? Its helpful to know this - or is it a secret? There are many people who have posted to this site asking the same question as you. In fact, there was a question just a couple of days ago that is still an active thread. If you type "Fairlady" into the SEARCH function, you will get LOTS of hits. It IS a Z.:classic: Alan T.

whoops - forgot to attach that FSM scan for how to find the VIN number.............

Well, it ought to have the full number ( INCLUDING the prefix ) stamped onto the firewall. Can you take another look? See the attached picture for places to find this information on the S130 series Z. Don't get confused just because the car is not actually badged as a "ZX". If its only got the "Fairlady Z" emblems then that's what you have. The S130 series was released in Japan in August 1978. I think you have one of the following: *FAIRLADY Z ( S130S ) - L20E engine *FAIRLADY Z-L ( S130 ) - L20E engine *FAIRLADY Z-T ( S130J ) - L20E engine *FAIRLADY Z 2 by 2 ( GS130S ) - L20E engine *FAIRLADY Z-L 2 by 2 ( GS130 ) - L20E engine *FAIRLADY Z-T 2 by 2 ( GS130J ) - L20E engine *FAIRLADY 280Z-L ( HS130 ) - L28E engine *FAIRLADY 280Z-T ( HS130J - BC ) - L28E engine *FAIRLADY 280Z-L 2 by 2 ( HGS130 ) - L28E engine *FAIRLADY 280Z-T 2 by 2 ( HGS130J - BC ) - L28E engine You said you have the L28E engine didn't you? In that case, just work out the trim level, and whether its a 2 seater or 2 by 2, and you will know pretty much which model it is from the above list. If your full VIN is missing or erased ( or just the VIN prefix ) then I would guess it may have been some kind of dodge to register it as a late S30 or S31 series Z when it was imported to Australia? I can't imagine any other reasons to mess with it that are not illegal. My guess is that you just have an early S130-series Z ( forget about the "ZX" bit ) and its early production date has caused confusion in the past as well as now. Its certainly not going to be 'pre-production' - so forget about that. I had a guy here in the UK excitedly telling me that he had a "pre-production 240Z" just because his VIN prefix was "S30" and not "HS30" - so you can see that the Japanese-market models cause some people to get rather over-excited. Try and work out your full VIN number if you can. Good luck! Alan T.

Hi Nick, That's interesting. Slightly worrying too! When I was looking for this information, I checked through all my Factory Engine Service manuals for the L20 / L24 / L26 / L28 engines. I have several different years, and several different market versions ( including some of the more comprehensive Japanese versions that seem to have dimensions and specs that the others do not ). To cut a long story short, I found every conceivable dimension and specification for these engines EXCEPT that one measurement. Dimensions for the cylinder block are very comprehensive, and they go into great detail about valve, valve guide and valve seat dimensions. They mention a fair bit about head warpage and acceptable tolerances - but always fall short of quoting an actual dimension for the head thickness.............. That made me suspicious. Why would they not quote something as important to us as that? They skirt all around the subject - even mentioning chamber volume and how it is affected by skimming the head - but never actually quote the thickness. The only reason I can think for them not quoting it is that it must be a little bit of a grey area. I wonder whether there was a Factory tolerance for this dimension that allowed a fair amount of variation? Varying thicknesses between the cam tower bore / cam tower base mounting and the mating surface of the cylinder head to the cylinder block would of course have an effect on the cam chain tension and the cam timing. Surely they must have had a tolerance to work within - but they never quote it. I got the dimension I quoted above from the "How to Modify" book by Frank Honsowetz - which contains a lot of useful information. I cross-referenced it with my stock of heads ( I have 9 heads and two whole engines to compare to ) and came up with no dimension bigger than 107.14mm on any of my heads. The 107.14 was from a known-history ( definitely never skimmed ) N42 that I have set aside for some port work. Some of my heads were just a smidge less than this - but the majority of them seem to have been skimmed at some point in the past ( some of them quite a lot! ). I know how to measure, and I have some good measuring tools at my disposal - but measuring these heads without a surface plate and height gauge is probably going to give a slightly different reading to me working with digital vernier calipers and micrometer - so I accept a slight tolerance for my error. That N42 was fairly consistant along its length - but some of the others measured slightly different along their lengths, which could be due to bad machining I guess. Its worrying that a firm "official" Factory dimension seems to be so hard to find. If anyone has any better information I would be very interested to hear it. Technically, I wonder if a small amount of variation is all that important for this dimension. There are other dimensions that are more important than the overall thickness, I suppose. Anyone else got any thoughts? Alan T.

Now you've blown it! Manchester is a different country altogether. My local team is Arsenal FC, and I can't stand them either.

Don't know about that. Got a few books. The knowledge is in them, not in me. Lately I've been checking which of my stock of heads has been shaved. That's why I had the dimension to hand. Good luck with the engine build:classic: Alan T.

James, Its 107.137mm or 4.218 Inches. Alan T.

Sometimes I think my car owns me, rather than the other way around............ I'd love to 'drop in' ( maybe at Interlaken ) but driving that thing around in the Alps would be hard work. I've driven an old car over the Alps before, and I needed some time off work when I got back. Let's wait until nearer to May 2004 before making a decision. Its over 6 months away for heaven's sake. Now you have planted a seed, though. Alan T.

Hi Andrew, Sorry to say that I have no photos of any Z cars at Geneva shows. Are you sure that your father saw one at the '69 Geneva show, and not the '70 or '71 event? If there was one displayed in those years then I'd love to see it too. Its spec would probably be a combination of the RHD and LHD 'Export' specs, judging by the French and Dutch market models that I have seen. Sorry I can't be of more help. Alan T.

Sorry - I meant the whole VIN ( including the prefix ). Can you find it on the car? Should be there. Alan T.

Hi 280zx Fever, I very much doubt that any "pre-production" Z ever made it out of Japan, or even out of the hands of the Factory. Please take a look at you VIN number and report it to us. That will clear the confusion up, I am sure. My bet is that your car is simply an early Japanese-market 280ZX ( S130 series ). Is that the car in your avatar image? Looks like an S130 to me. Let us know what the VIN is. All the best, Alan T.

Joseph, I agree. Mine ( on my ZG ) sounds just like yours ( no holes ). I think the earliest ones did not have the holes, and the Parts Lists for Japan don't show the holes either. Same part number though. Alan T.

Yes - it had the amber indicator section on the rear lights. They were probably still finalising a few details for the Export models even while this car was being diplayed. I think this car WAS intended for the USA / North American market. Surely it must have been? It was going to be their single biggest potential export market, after all. I would love to know what VIN number that car had ( if it had one? ). Careful what you say though, as we all know the Z was 'made' for the USA. Alan T.

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