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Arne

Mylar logo'd sunshades - Completed

Here's the final count:  

20 members have voted

  1. 1. Here's the final count:

    • [b]240-Z[/b]
      38
    • [b]280-Z[/b]
      4
    • [b]DATSUN[/b]
      18


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I wonder if Pete now has electronic versions of that font, and if so, what it would take to be able to get use of it for these?

Hi Arne:

There is an interview - Posted somewhere else on the site - where Peter is talking about the man that did the lettering on the BRE Cars - - originally they were hand painted. I think Adam C. was mentioning the fact that one could see the brush-marks in the lettering on one of the BRE cars...

So it might not actually be a BRE copyrighted design - but rather the hand work of the original sign painter - who is no longer with us. I doubt he ever actually released a Font in his name or intended any copy rights for an entire set of numbers/letters... More likely the sign painter used some existing font released to the public domain.

FWIW,

Carl B.

Edited by Carl Beck

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So it might not actually be a BRE copyrighted design - but rather the hand work of the original sign painter - who is no longer with us. I doubt he ever actually released a Font in his name or intended any copy rights for an entire set of numbers/letters... More likely the sign painter used some existing font released to the public domain.
Perhaps, and I'll be researching that angle as well. But on the other hand, the current BRE website graphics make heavy use of what appears to be the same font. It will be interesting to see if I get any response, and what that response might be.

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Here are some photos of the Mylar logo'd windshield sunshades that I put on my car in 1976. The letters have shrunk a little but they seem to be just under 3 inches and the over all is 4 3/4 inches.

post-13827-14150809207783_thumb.jpg

post-13827-14150809208098_thumb.jpg

post-13827-14150809208426_thumb.jpg

post-13827-14150809208746_thumb.jpg

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Excellent info, Michael, thank you! I have forwarded that and a couple of the pictures to the manufacturer for additional template tweaking.

Best guess on the font at this point is that BRE and the original Bolder Tints used something very similar to "Eurostile Bold Extended #2".

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Due to some late requests, I have increased the order of the 'DATSUN' sunshades from 20 to 24. We are approaching the time when no further additions will be possible, so if you are interested and haven't got on board yet, don't wait much longer.

The changes to the template size and shape have slowed the process some. I no longer think it likely that these will be shipped prior to Christmas. Possible, but not likely. Sorry for the delays, but we all want them to be right, and that is taking time.

Updated availability stats (12/7/09):


Item | 240-Z | DATSUN | Total |
-------------------------------------------
Ordered | 40 | 24 | 64 |
Paid for | 35 | 21 | 56 |
Pending | 1 | 0 | 1 |
-------------------------------------------
Available | 4 | 3 | 7 |

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Final size of the new product will be reduced from the 5 1/8" of the test papers to 4.5-4.75" to match measurements taken from originals. The logo characters will be 3" tall.

Still working to optimize the curve of the top edge, while allowing for the fact that there will be differences from car to car depending on the condition and manufacturer of the windshield gasket. I think we're actually real close on this now.

Latest work on the font/typeface is attached.

post-8596-1415080921258_thumb.jpg

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All payments for current requests have now arrived. Updated availability stats (12/7/09):


Item | 240-Z | DATSUN | Total |
-------------------------------------------
Ordered | 40 | 24 | 64 |
Paid for | 36 | 21 | 57 |
Pending | 0 | 0 | 0 |
-------------------------------------------
Available | 4 | 3 | 7 |

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I hope you guys can work out a decent font for these because the ones pictured just won't do.

Edit: This comment was actually based on the font design for the Datsun strip in post #98. I now see the new design in post #106 which looks much better in my opinion. See my post below for more detailed comments.

Edited by =Enigma=
For clarity

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Here is a photo comparison of my original with the new ones. Hope this helps.

post-13827-1415080923176_thumb.jpg

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I hope you guys can work out a decent font for these because the ones pictured just won't do.
Adam, can you explain your concerns with the font as attached in post #106?

The end goal from the very beginning has always been to reproduce a very popular period accessory for S30 cars here in the USA and Canada. At the beginning of the process we were working with the belief that all of the original dies and stencils still existed and were useable. As we progressed, neither has been the case. The manufacturer has been great, even though his quote was based on using existing tooling, he has worked with me far more extensively than planned to re-create the needed tooling, at the original quoted price. Neither of us expected this project to be as time intensive as it has become. We are still open to modifications at this time, but since most buyers have expressed an interest in these being as close to original as possible any modifications would need to be small tweaks, as most people I've conversed with seem to feel that the latest iteration are very close.

If this is not what you had in mind for the pair that you ordered and paid for, I will happily send you a check back and return your reserved parts to the available pool.

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Sorry Arne, the coment was actually based on Datsun example in post #98. Unfortunately I did not see that there was another page of posts with an update on the font design (post #106). That's what I get for viewing this from my PDA when I should have been working....This is also the reason why the comment was so brief, and sadly why the emotion and smiley wink at the end did not come across. I certainly appreciate the effort you and your vendor are putting into this and I do not wish to rescind my order at this time.

My concern with what I saw in post #98 was that the font for the Datsun example was too skinny for my tastes, but the example in post #106 looks much better, assuming that the thickness and size of the font used for the Datsun version will be the same relative to that displayed for the 240-Z version so far. I don't know what the original Datsun version looked like, but I like the design and font size used for the 240-Z version much better, and look forward to the seeing the final design.

Edited by =Enigma=

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Understood, Adam. No problems. The final version of the DATSUN shade will have the same thicker, extended font as the 240-Z version.

Both I and the manufacturer recall that there was a DATSUN version way back when, but neither of us can find any pictures of the original to compare to. He is certain that the same typeface was used for all of them, so that's what we are basing this on. Trying to duplicate the known look of the 240-Z shade and then using the same font, weight and kerning settings for the DATSUN one.

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Here is what I did from my original shade. Hope this helps. I will work on the Datsun as soon as I can.

post-13827-14150809232425_thumb.jpg

post-13827-14150809232622_thumb.jpg

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Mike, it looks like you condensed the font in height a bit, is that so? Did you note a percentage?

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Here is what I did from my original shade. Hope this helps. I will work on the Datsun as soon as I can.

These are easily the closest yet. To do a proper nit pick, the zero's need the very slight upper and lower radius. I can't tell in the photos, does the '2' needs a smooth radius transition between the curve and flat (on inside of angle)?

Still, nit-picks aside, those are very good.

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Arnie and Cam guy, I actually took my 280-Z picture and made it fit to the 3 7/8 inch height and held the ratio of height to length. I then used those to create the 280-Z on top of it in Photoshop. So the 280-Z is as close as I can get to a copy of mine. I then used that to create the 240-Z, the only number I had to recreate from scratch was the 4. I kind of guessed on it because if you make it the same width as the 8 it looked to wide, so I narrowed it down about 1/4 inch.

For the Datsun I just guessed, I kept the length of the Datsun the same as the 280-Z.

Cam Guy do you mean that the outside radius is to large, I agree that is could be a little closer to the top radius of the 2. It also looks like the 2 needs a small radius inside the bottom straight.

I can look at this on monday when I get to my studio.

I know we can get this so close that you won't be able to tell the difference.

What makes mine hard to use is that the numbers have shrunk a little and there is a ragged edge around the numbers about 1/16 inch.

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Edit - More reservations today, been a good day. Going fast, and not many left. Still time to add more to the order if demand continues, but the deadline for no further increases is rapidly approaching.

Updated availability stats (12/13/09):


Item | 240-Z | DATSUN | Total |
-------------------------------------------
Ordered | 40 | 24 | 64 |
Paid for | 36 | 21 | 57 |
Pending | 3 | 2 | 5 |
-------------------------------------------
Available | 1 | 1 | 2 |

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I can look at this on monday when I get to my studio.

I know we can get this so close that you won't be able to tell the difference..

Michael, what you've done so far is great. When you get it as good as we think can be done, will you be able to send me a full-size image that I can forward to the manufacturer?

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I grabbed the 240Z sample and tweaked it in Paint. I only changed what I was trying to describe in my first post. I don't have photoshop here at home but you get the idea. It's very subtle, which is why I tried to emphasize them as only nit picks. I'd still rock it

post-18904-14150809292296_thumb.jpg

post-18904-14150809292472_thumb.jpg

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Here are the new ones.

I took as measurements as close as I could on my 280-Z. Again the black letters and numbers did shrink a little. I tweeked mine to fit the new measurements and added the subtle radius to the "0" and to the top of the "2". The spacing on each number is not the same and the width of each is also different by 1/8 inch.

I also over lay my Datsun over the Datsun on the back of the BRE and this is what I got. The one I did was very close, I just had to adjust the width of some of the letters.

The height of the 240-Z should be 2 15/16 inch on a background of 4 3/4 inches. I would make the Datsun the same and then it would be about 19 inches across the window. The 140-Z and the 280-Z will be 20 3/8 inches across the window.

Arnie I will send them to you at 300 ppi or full size via email when they are completely approved and you are ready to go.

post-13827-14150809292589_thumb.jpg

post-13827-1415080929279_thumb.jpg

post-13827-14150809292898_thumb.jpg

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Thanks for that, Michael. I've got a message in to the manufacturer asking about format preference and such. Your images look great to me.

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One more reservation for a DATSUN sunshade this morning, which exhausts the expanded supply of those so far. If I get more requests soon, I can still add to the order, but that window is closing soon, I suspect.

Updated availability stats (12/14/09):


Item | 240-Z | DATSUN | Total |
-------------------------------------------
Ordered | 40 | 24 | 64 |
Paid for | 36 | 21 | 57 |
Pending | 3 | 3 | 6 |
-------------------------------------------
Available | 1 | 0 | 1 |

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Here are the new ones.

I took as measurements as close as I could on my 280-Z. Again the black letters and numbers did shrink a little. I tweeked mine to fit the new measurements and added the subtle radius to the "0" and to the top of the "2". The spacing on each number is not the same and the width of each is also different by 1/8 inch.

I also over lay my Datsun over the Datsun on the back of the BRE and this is what I got. The one I did was very close, I just had to adjust the width of some of the letters.

The height of the 240-Z should be 2 15/16 inch on a background of 4 3/4 inches. I would make the Datsun the same and then it would be about 19 inches across the window. The 140-Z and the 280-Z will be 20 3/8 inches across the window.

Arnie I will send them to you at 300 ppi or full size via email when they are completely approved and you are ready to go.

Something doesn't look quite right with these. Namely, the 2, 4, & 8 in these new images look skinny compared to the 0 & Z, or perhaps the 0 & Z are too fat. What I'm talking about here is the width of the lines that make up the chars, not the overall width of the chars.

Also, something looks off with the inner radiuses of the D (the inner void is too square) in DATSUN, as well as the inner/lower/left radius of the S in the DATSUN. Sorry to nit pick but I like the versions in post #106 better than these latest incarnations. Please take another look at these.

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Sorry to nit pick but I like the versions in post #106 better than these latest incarnations. Please take another look at these.
Don't be sorry. In this case, nit-picking is good. We want to come up with the best possible compromise, since the original stencils aren't available. (That would have been best, we all know.)

After reading Adam's comments, I think I agree. While I like the slightly oval'd shape of the zero in the ones in post #121, in most every other way I prefer either post #106 or posts #113 (240-Z) and #114 (DATSUN).

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