TomoHawk

YUK. UGLY. It doesn't look anything like an S30. It's just another import/Infinity. Besides needing two hours to wash & wax, they put the engine in the trunk.

Does anyone know of a source for the rubber boot that covers the Battery terminal on a 280Z alternator? MSA has nothing, and neither does eBay. Is that something you commonly find at the JY on newer vehicles maybe? thxZ

I can agree with most of your experiences; I've seen that happen too. That is basically what I have noticed myself, about how things work at shows with proud owners, and I have always accepted the results I got. Instead of trying to improve the score at the moment by arguing,I usually just ask about what kinds of things (if there is time to ask) should get attention (fix the carpeting, vacuuming, dusting, dash detailing, upholstery repairs, etc.) because as most people know, you can't honestly critique your own work! The score sheets only have deductions, and maybe a comment or two. It's impossible to see where you ought to be putting your efforts for the next time. Again, this topic isn't about what to do about losing points here or there. It's about defining the judge's protocol during a show, because that is as important area as "certification" or classing. It would even make the judging more consistent and fair.

As for numeric the Poll specifics, you should look for trends, not the individual percentages or ratios. To me, it says that people aren't happy that the engine was changed, or the interior was changed, or the body was changed. the specifics of the changes is another topic to discuss.

Most aren't there after the call to put away the towels is heard, and it's no fun waiting for the judge to get to you, so you start looking around, or get a snack/souvenir, or whatever. Even when it's required for the judge to open a door, or check a lamp, or whatever operational item is required by the rules (which is fair enough) some courtesy is in order for the car and owner, to ask him to do the operation. then if a judge needs to get into the car, there is a proper and respectful way to do that too, and it doesn't add any time to the process, provided the owner is there.Cooperation between judge and owner will actually save time, rather than cost time, provided the owner knows what to expect. One thing I forgot to mention earlier is that I have experienced personally, was a couple judges that weren't familiar how to operate the car or switch and almost broke something trying to operate something.

the poll may be ending, but that only refers to the voting. The discussion may continue, unless the topic is closed.

That is why this topic was started; to get more ideas together and refine it into something that is reasonable enough to submit. I already have some things written up, most of which were mentioned already, but many minds are always better than one when brainstorming. It was practically impossible to get the most recent, important, changes made, let alone to add a new section defining a whole new set of rules to something so many think "isn't broke." It's not "broken- just incomplete.

Instead of a 5 ft. rule, let's just call it an arm's-length rule instead, to make it more fair for the judges, but still respectful for the vehicle and owner. Gnoses's comment about how an intensive 2-day inspection is a little much is correct, but the Z car/S30 isn't about that, and the ZCCA judging criteria allows for a LOT of variation or flexibility. This topic isn't about the strictness of the judging criteria or any judging criteria for that matter. It's about defining how judges should act while examining the vehicle and how intrusive things should get. BTW- most antique or marque organizations that I know of require a fire extinguisher (10BC) and you get DsQ'd without one- even outdoors. I'm not aware of disabling the electrical stuff, but it doesn't seem unreasonable- at the most you would just need to reset a few things afterwards. For indoors, some require such things as an empty gas tank or special fire-retardants added to the gasoline.

You don't need to open a door to look into the interior of a vehicle. I have looked into hundreds and have seen it all just by sticking my head through the open window, in a respectful way. Having the window open is enough so you can put your head in there and see anything you'd like to see. This is NOT an issue of sour grapes. The mistakes I've noticed only remind me that there definitely needs to be some guidelines for judges enumerated so both judge and owner will know what is expected and how far each can go. If anything else is needed, as polite "may I....?" will take care of things. If you really have that many vehicles to go over, then a pairs of judges is in order.

That is why the owners are there, to politely remind the judges of certain things, such as "Let me open the door for you," or, "let me turn on the lights and toot the horn for you." It should be added to the ZCCA Judging Manual.

the ZCCA Judging Manual has nothing regarding a judge's protocol. It's basically just a set of instructions on what to look at, and what to deduct points on. In addition, there are some very notable national organizations that do have protocols set for a judges behavior and judging requirements. The AACA for example, has a judges handbook that's over 100 printed pages ad it goes into detail about everything from authentic bodies to original engines to correct tires. And it also includes a section on a judge's behavior. The Studebaker Driver's Club is another and the Vintage Chevrolet Club of America is another. These are all more prestigious than the ZCCA...

I wanted someone to ask for details, which shows interest. The first item refers to the glove box light. The "Judge" opened the glove box door, didn't see any light (it was about 2pm in July) and I got penalized. the second item was that the door was purposely locked, because I wanted the judge to ask permission, and instead got penalized. The third item happened to a friend. The judge practically climbed into a wheel well to look for dirt, and found some. Remember that these cars (S30s) are antiques and some are further towards coming apart than some, so it is only respectful that the owner is asked to poperate these things to prevent damage to the car, and the club's and the ZCCA's reputation, or worse... My club hosted the 2008 convention, and there was no mention of this in the paperwork besides the usual disclaimer about damage in general.There is no such rule or precedent that I know of allowing anyone to touch or enter the vehicles. Please expand on this. no, there is no explict 5 ft. rule, but there is no requirement for anyone to become invasive about finding things to deduct points. Judges are busy enough without having to crawl under or into vehicles.Picky is what separates those who have spent hundreds of hours preparing their cars for a "judged" show. A ZCCA judged show at the annual convention is exactly the occasion to be very, very picky. That might be all well and good, but so are the owners, and remember that the cars (S30s) are considered antiques, so respect is in order.Will If you need that much time, I'd suggest using a text editor like Notepad to create your statement before you are ready to submit it.

the judging rules seem to be adequately defined in the ZCCA Judging Manual for the cars, but there are no guidelines or protocols for the judges themselves. Something, like a Judge's section needs to be added to keep them in line. I can say that myself, because, over the years, at several shows utilizing the ZCCA rules, there were mistakes made by "judges" that were incorrect because they were basically just some guys pulled off the sidewalk at the last minute. One problem/mistake was by a judge who incorrectly tried to operate the vehicle, and deducted points because he didn't get the result he expected. Another was a judge who was not respectful of the car and deducted points because the door was purposely locked. A third mistake was from a judge who made an invasive test on the car's mechanics. By defining what things a judge may do, and how to present himself during a judging will eliminated most, if not all judging problems, and make the event a better experience for all involved. For the first problem mentioned, the judge should have asked the owner to operate the control, and he would have found it working perfectly. the judge hadn't read the car's owner's manual and therefore didn't know how to operate that control. For the second problem, the judge should have asked the owner's permission to enter the car, and he would have gotten it, provided he didn't actually get IN the car. For the third problem, the judge should have just looked from the same distance that any spectator would have used, instead of going up close. these three basic rules (no touching, ask permission, "5 foot rule") would have eliminated all the problems, and made the judging process fair and less time-consuming. I think there might be occasions when you might need to get very picky, such as to break a tie-score, but for 99% of the time, it doesn't need to be that way. It's also a little late to get this section added to the ZCCA Judging Manual for this year's convention, but it is timely enough for next year's and anything else in the future. thxZ

You'll need the big engine to put that snow plow front around on the highway. I would keep it in the garage. .. With the door CLOSED.

As a summary, the BCDD was removed, a block-off plate was made and attached (with some RTV sealer and screws) and the distributor's vacuum advance was connected to one of the small tubes that are coming from the bottom of the throttle (test which works first.) I was considering drilling out or enlarging the vacuum hole in the throat, but I think you don't really need that much vacuum to operate the advance (for most driving types) so it was left as-is.

Thank you, Mr. Blake, I didn't know that. Is the mount for the dashpot of any use otherwise? It just seems to occupy space, and can probably be removed. I wonder why I didn't ask while I was servicing the throttle body.

Stainless Steel bolt kits, for the engine or the body or interior..... Modification or 'upgrade?' IMO, it's an upgrade in most places, especially places that will get exposed to the elements of Mother Nature, a long as they are not polished to a chrome-like sheen. Also, stainless steel bolts aren't needed for the interior of the S30, and aren't even exposed, so the original or hardware-store fasteners are adequate.

I would wonder what hasn't been modified on that car. The person would have been better off just buying a corvette to start with. It's worse than the car in the movie Corvette Summer. YUK.

There was never a throttle dashpot on the engine. It doesn't slam closed anyway.

My deletion of the BCDD was successful, there are no vacuum leaks, and the distributor's vacuum advance is working correctly.

Reality s reality; with or without photographs.

I suppose you mean a straight-6 of V8?

I just keep it clean and well-maintained. A tall, smart brunette with a job and good navigational skill?

No Ford 9 inch punkin? I usually tell airplane owners that the engine is upside down- the carburetor goes ON THE TOP

The engine is backwards. The distributor goes towards the front. Again, a V8 doesn't belong there, even if it has an old alternator.