Smokey

I went out this morning to take a second look at the battery tray, and adjoining areas. Based on what I have read here, I think it better to walk away from this one. The rust is caused by battery acid. The damage strtches clear to the top of the inner fender where the paint is beginning to peel off. It is onto the frame rail, but I think the inside is OK. The worst part is that it is in the seam between the firewall and wheelhouse. The seam sealer has even begun to decay letting in the nasty acid. In addition to looking here, I also went in for a second look at the pans. There is some minor surface rust forming at the trailing end near the seat crossmembers. This looks to be dormant, but would need to be sand blasted to remove. With the acid damage in the major structural portion, and the need of suspension work, along with the seat, radio, etc... I think I need to walk away from this for the price that he is asking. I would not even be willing to offer him half of the 11K, which would only insult the man. Here are 2 pictures of the rust damage in the battery area. Pic 1

Victor, she looks nice. Must have been rusted in out of the way places that made it not worth repairing. From the pics, it looks flawless.

I don't think that they ever came from the factory like that. They might have been a dealer installed item in '73 and '74 to combat the flat top carbs. I think from the factory, they only came with the dual SU's.

OK, I stand corrected. I, for some reason, thought Aussies had KPH speedos. Figured us Yanks were the last of the MPH for the most part. Sorry for the assumption.:stupid:

Yeah, then they would be safe. Sharks don't eat their own kind.

The one with the MPH either has a replacement speedo, or the dash has been changed out. The engines were not always put in in sequence. They came in groups with other assemblies, and were put in the bodies in no certain order.

Check here for a 1971. It does not run currently. The intake and carbs are off of it. It needs floor pans. The fenders are new Nissan parts, but were never painted so there is some surface rust on them. That is about all I know on that one. I spoke with him briefly about a month ago.

Yeah, I know what you are trying to convey. It is the same spot that I saw rust through on the Red one in the passenger wheel well. Thanks for the advice, I will be putting it through all these tests on Wednesday.

Thanks for the clarification on the battery rust Carl. I'm going back to look at the orange one on Wednesday morning. I plan on pulling the battery and poking around to see just what will be involved there. I will also take some pictures if I can get my hands on a digicam (the polariod sux). As I remember the rust is kinda tan on the orange car. The paint is flaking off, like scales. There are lime green.....ummmm......striations????. They look like a slow paint drip that ran down the inner fender. This is on top of the paint. To confuse matters, where the paint was wetsanded before, there is lots of residue that has dripped down in this area too. I need to go in and wipe everything down to fully evaluate what is there. I'll keep you posted.

You should be able to go about 300 miles between fillups. That is pushing it. I usually filled up at 250 miles. That was around 20 miles/gallon, and was a '72 240Z.

Sounds like your steering rack has gone bad. Should not be caused by anything in particular that you have done. It is just something that happens with age. Mustangs are notorious for this. That noise you heard when things were still cold is called morning sickness. That is usually a tell tale sign that the seals in the rack are giving up. Just get a remand rack and put it in there. Try not to go with used unless you have to, as they might be on their last legs as well.

Good job!! That looks almost doable with a little fab work.

OK, gonna talk to this guy again this weekend. Gonna try and set up a time to look at the Z again, at his house. Based on what I have posted about the car, is there anything I need to be looking for, or asking him? I will go with the intention of pulling the battery out and checking to see how much damage has been done, and get some pictures. I will also be checking out the condition of the original wheels and hubs, along with the radio. I am thinking about asking for $7500 to start with. This price is considering the $1300 to get the suspension straightened out, and A/C either working or removed at Rock's. Figure about $1500 to fix the battery rust issue. $200 to fix the driver's seat, and add a few for rebushing the shifter. That represents $3000 in work that needs to be done to get it to where he has valued it. I figure we will negotiate from there. How does that sound? This is a very strong contender in my search for a Z. For the right price I think she will have to come home with me.

Pull the plug out and see the condition. If it looks like it is coated with burnt oil, then you have a ring problem. If the tip is normal with just a little carbon on it, put it back in and make sure it is torqued down properly, to seat the gasket/washer. Depending on how long they have been in, now might be a good time to pull them all and check their condition and replace them with new.

Just got back from looking at the car in Asheboro. This is the same car that was up on Ebay until today. It is also on Collector Car Trader if anyone is looking at it. He never did get any bids on Ebay, and he wants $12.5 for it on trader. The way he describes it, it sounds wonderfully restored. I nibbled at the bait and went down to see it. The previous owner traded it for a Mazda MX6 (so that tells you how much he valued his Z). I did a walk around and here is what I found. The rockers both have rust blisters showing and the trailing edge near the rear wheel is packed with Bondo. As I tapped with my magic knuckle the rocker went tink, tink, tink, clunk, and finally thud behind the weld seam. Clunks are OK, cause that is just layered metal. The thud has little metal content. The cowl vents are pitted heavily and rust is beginning to show in the crevices. I imagine the underside of the cowl looks aweful. The driver's fender does not fit as snug as it should, indicating possible collision damage. The quarter panel beside the tail pipe is damaged. It looks like it got hung on a curb. The weld seam has been compromised up to the tail light where it has actually broken. All emblems are there, but in need of restoration. The kicker was when I started to look in the fender wells. It looked like the fronts had been coated with POR-15 by brush. It was all clean, and I could see no rust----except----for under the battery compartment. About 8 inches of the weld seam was under attack by body rot. This came down approx a 1/4 of an inch into the undercoating. This was a bad sign from the picture I had seen/posted. I decided then and there that this was not the car. But, I decided to look it over in case anyone here wanted to know about it. I got Barry (owner) to open the car up. The hatch was the first area I looked at. The seams on the deck were coated with POR-15, but looked solid. The hatch was in good shape. The full carpet kit looked real good. The spare tire well had some surface rust in the low portions, along with built up debris. All finish panels appeared to be in fair to good condition. Under the hood things were pretty clean. The strut towers has POR-15 applied to the seams. There was an overflow jug in front of the radiator on the driver's side. The radiator looked new and the coolant was a good shade of green (important later on). under the battery was the evidence of major rust damage. Massive pitting was still there, but painted over. The rust had begun to spring up again in the place that the picture shows earlier in the post. The damage covered the wheel house, firewall, and inner fender. Of course, it also went into the seam. Appeared solid, but I did not remove the battery to examine. Inside both floor pans were solid but had a good amount of rust developing near the toe boards, and along the edges. The carpet kit was stuck in several places, so I could not pull all of it out. The hole in the firewall around the master cylinger was corroded from brake fluid. The interior plastic was in good shape. The choke handle was broken, and the glove box was collapsed. The gages all worked cept for the clock. When driving it, there was a fair amount of exhaust fumes getting into the cabin. It would also hesitate and backfire even after getting to operating temp. Everything sounded good mechanically. However, I did notice sitting at a stop light, the temp gage went up about 3/4 of the way to the end of the sweep. This went back down when we pulled away. Looks like this car has some cooling issues as it was prolly 45 degrees when I was driving it. The exhaust makes some noise when the motor is turned up from movement and torquing. Bottom line--the car is worth about $3000. A far cry from the $12,500 he thinks he will be getting. Lemme know if I can answer any more questions on this car. Oh yeah, one more thing. The brakes feel like the master cylinder is shot. Only a few hard stops until you are driving the flinstone mobile. Rest of the suspension is fine.

Carl, Just so I know. What does the acid rust look like when compared to moisture rust. The orange car has what looks to be lime green trails coming from the tray. The rust is peeling the (thin) layer of paint up in about a 12"x15" patch under the tray down to the rail. I am assuming this is from acid. Going to go and look at the Asheboro car before work. I'll report back when I get a chance.

It should be the same size and thread pitch. One thing to watch out for is, as low as the motor sits, you don't want to whack off the drain plug. I think it will stick out a little further than the original plug. Just a thought.

Hmmmm, been looking at too many rears tonight :classic: . Does there seem to be a difference in these two cars. look where I have circled around the tail pipe. On the red one, the driver's quarter seems to come up too high. Maybe a real bad patch job from rust. On the orange one, the quarter is level with the rear valance. This is original metal, and no repair has taken place. Am I seeing things or is this a little fishy?

Yeah, if it were not for the battery rust on the orange one I looked at the other day, I would jump all over it. Its just that the rust trail had gotten down onto the frame rails (and quite possibly inside). Thanks for the heads up on the "inside" part Carl:D . I can deal with the suspension and the seats. That is not a big deal. Would it be possible to gain an advantage with a closed cell battery like Optima? They do not leak, even when upside down. If that is the case, they could do a better job of preventing future rusting. They might also be able to stand sitting for longer periods of time without going dead. Just a thought.

Check out the full carpet kit in the trunk. Have not seen too many like this.

Pic of the interior. Notice how the seat backs have been swapped. The seat belt hangers are on the wrong side now.

Another from the front

Here are the frame rails. They look to have been painted recently so accurate condition is unknown.

Here is a close up under the tray by the drain hose. Rust looks like it might be pretty bad under the paint, but hard to tell from the picture.

Not 10 minutes after saying that I give up on wanting a Z, I find myself talking to someone selling one. I don't know how I called, I just realized I was talking to him on the phone. After looking at the latest '70 yesterday, I had become discouraged since it has so much rust under the battery. The seats were shot, the shifter was spongy (to be nice), and the front suspension needed attention. Not to mention that the AC and radio did not work. For 11K I really expected a nicer Z. Now, I have not written that one off entirely, I am just waiting to see what else presents itself, and might hopefully be able to convince him to sell it to me for $7500 to $8500. I looked into this Ebay car to see what the deal was on it. It is also a '70, build date 9/70 and VIN 10095. I talked with Barry who runs the car lot it is at. He says he just got it in on trade cause the PO's daughter needed a new car. He had run out of garage space. Incidently the Z is being kept outside while at the lot. The E bay site has had no activity and is still showing starting bid of $8850. The trader side shows a selling price of $12.5. Somehow I think the $8850 might be the lowest he intends to go in negotiations. Anyway, Barry says that this is the nicest Z he has seen in this area. The only rust he knows of is under the battery tray, which is described as a quarter sized place. There are no bubble or blemishes in the paint. He does not know how long ago the car was painted. The PO had the car for only a year. he bought it from another used car lot in Winston-Salem, NC. I will attach some of the MANY pictures I have of this car to get some feedback. Battery tray from top.