madkaw

It’s typical for #5 to blow the HG . Go get a coolant pressure checker from a local parts store and do a pressure check

Not to disparage this thread , but that’s why recently I opted for a 71C for my 83 truck. You can t find B’s because they don’t last, parts are hard to come by , and have a weak counter bearing . C kits are cheaper and more abundant and they don’t break as much because they are stronger . 

8 hours ago, Matthew Abate said:

When I looked at the advance curves spreadsheet that Walter Moore put together I saw that he recommended against the 80-83 distributors because the mechanical and vacuum advances together were potentially dangerous, so I was prioritizing the 79 in my search.

However, I have found one or two errors in that data so maybe it’s not the case.

Depending on your build you might not want tor need the vacuum advance . I didn’t run one and ran between 17-20 degrees initial and had 35-38 all in . Ultimate would be a compromise between mechanical and vacuum , but if there is probably going to be a failure in any part of those dizzies it’s the vacuum advance . 

26 minutes ago, Matthew Abate said:

I’m starting to research my options for the ignition on my car and the ‘79 distributor swap is one of the paths I might take. Since total cost is a factor in this, I thought I should see what they run.

Do any of you have one in good shape (preferably with minimal to no refurbishing required) to sell? If so please send me a direct message with your asking price. I’m not ready to jump on it yet, but finding one here and getting a good price could push me into a decision.

Why not consider the ZX dizzy from 81-83 if doing the swap . 2 wires with a built in module and a decent curve for a modified motor. 

Looks like you might be off one tooth/gear . Looks like you are sitting close to 12 o’clock. 

Good advice above , spark plugs out and crank till you see oil. I actually use a separate spindle that has no crank gear on it to spin the pump with a drill. Good way to prime motor

Drive the Bw-t5 and you’ll be hooked 🙂

43 minutes ago, siteunseen said:

Thanks Steve! I may get some pliers. I remember using a deep socket to tap mine down but I didn't feel completely confident so I went with OE seals. I used the Fords as a practice run on an e88. Sometime soon I'll be putting them on an e31 with a high lift cam. Your private messaging still works the same I suppose?

Many questions I'll be asking, I'm sure.

I think you have to get them really far off to leak actually . I read all the FAQ’s about installing them , and I guarantee I didn’t get some of them ‘ perfect’ on my last motor, never had an issue . If there’s no gaping holes and you don’t plow them all the way down, I think you’ll be okay. The ones I suspect as leaking -HAD to be tapped on quite forcefully. 

34 minutes ago, siteunseen said:

How did you figure the valve seals were down far enough without creating that bulge? We talked about a few years ago and I used a certain height with feeler gauges. You said you were going to make some type of spacer maybe?

 

I made a spacer that straddles the guide . I also invested in some guide seal pliers.  With pliers I didn’t have to tap the seals on . I had enough control with the pliers to ease them on and avoid the bulge . 

35 minutes ago, grannyknot said:

Strange, did you check the clocking on the rings? Maybe the ends were too close to one another?

Yes - “stacked “ gaps was a concern . Still hard to explain why top ring would be covered with oil and second ring not

We there was no smoking gun found. I took apart the head and put new guide seals all the way across. I used that Fel-Pro Ford seals that I’ve used before . 

I also pulled #6 piston to look at it. Nothing looked bad except all the oil on the top compression ring . Pretty soaked actually . Oddly, the second ring was pretty damn clean.  The expansion ring was properly installed and not overlapped. Kind of hard to believe the oil is coming from the bottom of the piston and not getting on the second compression ring. Makes me think the oil is coming from the top . None of the guide seals “looked “ bad . 

I put it all back together and will be firing it up shortly. Checked cam degree and it was about dead nuts , so nothing changed there. 

I did play with putting together my coolant manifold . Not that it will do any good with a none running motor -lol. 

My son just doesn’t want to get greasy dirty - clean freak, but at least his room was clean. My daughter probably understands cars more then most men her age (30). At least my son will have a degree and already has made his fame and the daughter will always be employed - SO - dad won’t be supporting anyone but the Z -lol

20 hours ago, 240260280 said:

Reminds me of Grannyknot's BMW... 3 good. 3 bad.

His oil rings were messed up.

Interesting 

https://images.app.goo.gl/s7MedL1SofYUqDMXA

Set up has not changed from the last motor . Motor swap only . 

PCV is basically centered or even biased towards to front runners. I would also think #4 would be worse in that case . 

I think it’s one cylinder supplying the oil and it’s being dispersed into the other two because of proximity of the n42 intake . 

4 hours ago, jonbill said:

What's the mechanism of oil getting in the intake runners from inside the Chambers? Reversion?

That’s the question!

Okay - turns out I have an oil issue . Oil is getting into to cylinders 4-6 , progressively worse from 4 on . The oil is diluting the charge and causing a misfire - especially in 6. 4&5 seems to be able to burn it off . 
I removed the intake to check for vacuum leaks to find an oily film in the runners 4-6 . Runners of intake and head both had oil film. 
First suspect was/is the valve stem seals. I tried a different kind on this build vs my L24. Visually they looked fine . They took a lot of persuasion to install and thought maybe I used too much . Last seals were a Ford seals , which were difficult because they are finicky as hell to install. 
Actually replaced #6 seal while head was in motor - ran motor and still have same results . Not being able to pin this down I decided to pull the head and look at the guides and anything else . Getting good at this now I guess - 1 hour later the head was on the beach . But no smoking gun found . I ordered more seals anyway.

Decision time now . Do I go deeper and pull pistons or throw all new valve seals on and reinstall head and keep fingers crossed ? I was getting ready to leave town and really wanted an answer so I dropped the pan and pulled 6.

Still no smoking gun - as far as my experience(novice) eyes can tell. Got on the phone to my machinist - but didn’t hear back yet. My inspection was very quick , so when I’m back in town I will scrutinize closer . 
Just trying to determine source of oil . I was expecting to see a collapsed expansion ring or another failed ring . There was marks on the bores on the thrust side that were fairly significant visually  , but nothing you could feel.

I have an extra assembled f54 flat top short block sitting there untouched by amateur hands  with 110k miles with perfect wear in the bores . Also pulled a couple of bearings and everything looked spot on. Depending on what I find or not find it might be the next plan. With the head off it makes assembly decision equal. 

Though this is frustrating , the hobby of engine building will have these outcomes I guess . Not being a stock engine makes this more of a challenge . Missing the L24 right about now because I enjoy driving my car - a lot ! I was hoping for more engine swap and tune - not engine swap and troubleshoot . Hopefully I learn from my mistakes 

40 minutes ago, Captain Obvious said:

Haha!! Just trying to pay it forward.   

What's the prospect of all three of us having our new shiny motors powering our cars at ZCON 2020?

Maybe I’ll sneak in there too with a fresh motor - if I ever get the beast to stay together - lol

There’s also the option that the machinist used bronze inserts vs knurling the guides and they were/are too tight. Maybe material from wearing on the inserts ruined the seals ? Several possibilities 

I doubt a seal would stick a valve under running conditions . Does sound like the oil burn is a valve seal though. 

This is a problem I’m having now is finding the source of oil. Like you said , a leak down test won’t help find it. 

There’s no specific numbers I can brag on , but there’s no contest , especially if you want to run a performance cam or performance engine .

I run 45 degrees at cruise and can idle at 18 degrees . You can’t hardly get a dizzy to do that since the vacuum advance is linked to the total advance . 
 

Cam sensor really helps for smoother idle and getting that last % of precision from EFI . 

I would argue the statement of probably not better power . Timing control is a big part of these motors . To have full control of timing in any load situation is a far and above the compromise of a dizzy - however it might be recurved . 
I think it’s safe to say power improvements are about guaranteed . 
 

Cam sensor is nice , but not necessary . I’ve run years without it . 

Well you’ll need a way to control the spark - ECU . Then you need a way to tell the ECU crank position . Then you can do what you want . The options are many .

With 3.90 gears I drive around town in third gear with my TEP lightened flywheel . That was with a 2.4 with a 490 cam. If your engine is strong with those gears you will be fine. 

I realized after rereading the thread that this is an untouched used bottom end - so your numbers are healthy for sure . I would be happy with the vacuum readings for sure . I have a 54 block with 110k miles that I need to put a head on . I don’t plan on touching it either since the bores look perfect .

I forgot to add that the other good thing was my cable linkage has been flawless so far - but I probably jinxed myself now -lol