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Testing Spoiler in 1969


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The word 'Testing' might be doing quite a lot of heavy lifting in this context.

I would say it had already been 'tested' in Japan, approved for production, lined up to be fitted as standard equipment on the 432-R, and an extra-cost showroom option on the other Japanese market models.

With the initial batch(es?) of North American market models being somewhat de-contented to meet a low RRP, it seems unlikely that a rear spoiler would have made the cut in any case.

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So, here's the QED. Do we look solely at the 'Datsun 240Z' / HLS30U and its local sub-variants for our research and understanding of these cars, or do we look at the whole family?

I think the answer is obvious, but I find myself posting in another thread today where it seems, to some, not to be.    

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I think they tested many parts in many places.  The spoiler in the photo I posted is not in others from North America in 69 so they were testing it somehow.

btw do you have photos of, or a link to, that 432 article in Oct or Nov 1969 that Kats posted?  I was wondering if a spoiler was in that piece. It was real track testing of the 432 by a Nissan factory racer if I recall.

btw II: I'm glad they did not try the spoiler in Canada in the snow at high speeds with no air dam... can you imagine the front end lifting in snow!!!

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1 hour ago, 240260280 said:

I think they tested many parts in many places.  The spoiler in the photo I posted is not in others from North America in 69 so they were testing it somehow.

I just think it would have been a little late to be developing parts like that. After all, this was taking place a matter of weeks before the 432-R would go on show as a finished product - available to buy - with the rear spoiler as standard equipment.

 

1 hour ago, 240260280 said:

btw do you have photos of, or a link to, that 432 article in Oct or Nov 1969 that Kats posted?  I was wondering if a spoiler was in that piece. It was real track testing of the 432 by a Nissan factory racer if I recall.

I think you're talking about the January 1970 issue of MOTOR FAN magazine, which featured a 432 in one of their comprehensive road tests. Being a stock 432, it didn't have a rear spoiler fitted as standard equipment (it was an extra cost showroom option, so the car had to be ordered with one) and was tested as such.

Here are a few pages from the article:

 

Jan70-Motor-Fan-1.jpg

Jan70-Motor-Fan-2.jpg

Jan70-Motor-Fan-3.jpg

Jan70-Motor-Fan-4.jpg

Jan70-Motor-Fan-6.jpg

Jan70-Motor-Fan-7.jpg

Jan70-Motor-Fan-8.jpg

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Many thanks.  That's the one. Nice to see what Nissan did in 69.  I was going to scrutinize the 432 pictures for a spoiler 🙂 Thanks for checking.  I was a bit surprised to see it in the USA too so I figured I'd look around to see if there were more examples of it in 69. 

 

The wind tunnel tests (full and small scale) show the direction of Nissan in (67/68)?  Wings on cars go back to ~1928 but they did not come back to racing until mid-late 60's (When Nissan was developing aero parts for the Z)... nice!

 

This  may be the blue one shown at the 69 Tokyo Motor Show.

1969 image.jpg

 

 

Edited by 240260280
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1 hour ago, 240260280 said:

432R at 1969 Tokyo Motor Show.  I will guess it has spoiler.  It would be nice to see photos of this.

432-R on October 18th 1969, at Nissan's Ginza, Tokyo head office for the 'Press Preview' event prior to the opening of the Tokyo Motor Show:

 

 

432R at Press Preview event-1.jpg

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3 hours ago, 240260280 said:

I'm trying to find an earlier bolt-on spoiler but this may be the first application.

Shelby and Ferrari along with some USA cars had integrated spoilers and wings earlier but Nissan may have had a first bolt-on. 

Did the Skylines have spoiler accessories at this time?

KPGC10 Skyline GT-R had a homologated bolt-on rear spoiler/reverse wing, but it was a Sports/Race Option part and not standard equipment or a showroom order option. In any case, it was nearly a year later than the 432-R.

You'll end up chasing your tail looking for the 'first' rear spoiler, especially if you insist on it being 'bolt-on' rather than an intrinsic part of body design (Kamm tail et al), and Google searches in English will probably be dominated by USA Uber Alles effect, where people think that GTO means Pontiac product. Nevertheless, certain Shelby Mustangs, the aforementioned Goats and several other proto Muscle Cars will certainly be in with a shout. Mr B might even pipe up and cite something called a "Camero", whatever that is when it's got its hat on...

I reckon your time would be better spent trying to spread the word that the first S30-series Z rear spoiler wasn't a BRE design, which is something I've seen and read many times. I may even remember reading it on a now-deleted zhome.com page. 

GTO:

rear spoiler 250 GTO.jpg

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1961 Ferrari 196 is reported to be first on one web site

These 5 production cars were the first to bring spoilers to the market |  Driving

 

Brock knew about the effect early and applied to the Daytona Coupe in 1964. Perhaps that is the mix-up in Nissan origin or perhaps he got involved in 69 with Nissan spoilers as he raced the roadster for them and may have passed on some advice... I guess it could have been a 2 way street but I don't want to make a 2nd Goertz.

Le Mans 1964 Shelby Cobra Daytona Liveries (2 skins) | RaceDepartment

Edited by 240260280
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1 hour ago, 240260280 said:

1961 Ferrari 196 is reported to be first on one web site

These 5 production cars were the first to bring spoilers to the market |  Driving

 

Block new about the effect early and applied to the Daytona Coupe in 1964. Perhaps that is the mix-up in Nissan origin or perhaps he got involved in 69 with Nissan spoilers as he raced the roadster for them and may have passed on some advice... I guess it could have been a 2 way street but I don't want to make a 2nd Goertz.

 

Both that 196 SP 'Fantuzzi Spyder' and the Cobra Daytona Coupe were examples born of Kamm tail type styling, and both integral to the shape of the rear ends on the cars. The Daytona more exaggerated, but still integral. You were talking about add-on/bolt-on spoilers previously. My 250GTO pic is an example of a bolt-on being tested. Some people will argue that these are low-volume racing specials, and we should be looking more at series production road cars. The 432-R could fall into both camps depending on viewpoint.

Trust me, Brock never had anything to do with the rear spoiler on the 432-R. I'm a big admirer of his work (especially with the Daytona Coupe, although I think AC's own A98 Coupe was both more lovely and more efficient) but let's give Nissan and their engineers a little bit more kudos for their work, please.

AC A98 Coupe:

 

BPH 4B the AC98 Coupe.jpg

Edited by HS30-H
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  • 4 weeks later...

autovisie front.jpg

Take a good look.. a spoiler was standard on a 240z in the Netherlands for as far i know. I still got one laying around on my attick from my 1972 240z Orig. Dutch car.

In this pic a story of Johan Cruyff  our famous eh ... football ? uh soccer! player..  (I don't give a damn about that, In fact i BLOODY HATE IT!!! )

Here some of the rest of the pages i stumbled upon haha..

Good luck with your translations hihi...😁

autovisie.jpg

autovisie 2.jpg

autovisie 3.jpg

autovisie1.jpg

 

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