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Patcon

Cody's Goon

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9 hours ago, Patcon said:

I guess some of that depends on what alloy is used

I believe that is the case as well. I think the extent of the effects is related to the grade of stainless and the temperature reached. But you're right... Nowhere to go but up, and you went way up!

And even if the stainless properties are down a little, it's not like it's going to spontaneously rust overnight in that one spot. It might surface rust slowly or something like that. An occasional buff down with scotchbrite would probably be enough to keep from attracting undesired attention.

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Ok, so I need some diagnostic help. Cody's 510 has been acting up lately.

He describes it as trying to feed it gas but it won't go and the engine doesn't speed up. I have been working from the position that it's a fueling issue. I removed the carb a while back and tried to clean it but opening up the glass float bowl was difficult and I didn't want to break it so, I cleaned it the best I could and reinstalled it. Some times it drives great, sometimes it acts like it's starving.

We have replace the fuel filter in the engine bay.

So today we drained the gas tank looking for rust or water in the tank. Nothing! The fuel looked perfect...

We did replace the dizzy a while back with a used match box dizzy. We don't remember if we had this problem before we replaced the dizzy...

Ideas?

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Fuel pressure or ignition.   Maybe have Cody give the ignition module a shot of canned cold air when the problem occurs,  then see if the motor runs normally again.   Maybe a fuel pressure test to rule that out.   I would assume you have already verified the float level.

Best of luck.

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The stock carbon the 510 has a glass float window. IT has lines in it for the float level. One time when it acted up I told him to shut it down immediately and verify there is fuel in the carb. He said there was...

My best guess at this point is trash in the float bowl even though I can't see any or an ignition issue?

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1 hour ago, siteunseen said:

Did you get a new phone from Santa Claus this year?  Just messing around with you Charles, you know I love you.

Roll Tide, Roll...

Nope, we'll see how the Tide does...B)

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On 1/7/2018 at 6:42 PM, S30Driver said:

Fuel pressure or ignition.   Maybe have Cody give the ignition module a shot of canned cold air when the problem occurs,  then see if the motor runs normally again.   Maybe a fuel pressure test to rule that out.   I would assume you have already verified the float level.

I considered the matchbox being the issue a awhile back, but one of the days it acted up the low was like 7d F. I can't imagine the box running hot then.

was leaning towards a blockage in the carb float bowl or an ignition issue, but I have had a hard time coming up with test to isolate the problem. So we think we  might come up with some more info. We the car acts up (which) seems very random it will loose power and he will try to feather the pedal to keep it running. It usually stalls. Then he restarts it.

So the last couple of times it has done it. When it stalls I told him to just cut it off then restart it. Yesterday when he thought it was acting up he pulled over cut it off and restarted it immediately. Issue was gone...

So that makes me suspect maybe a bad ignition switch or possibly a bad connection causing the loss of voltage at the coil or the matchbox. Thoughts? Ideas on a test to validate this?

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Starting at what I've learned as "first principles" might help.  Control of air volume is what determines engine speed, for the most part.  That's where the word "throttle" came from, to describe the mechanism that controls engine speed.  The SU's have a somewhat unique mechanism of controlling air flow via the piston, which s actuated by manifold pressure, as I understand things.  Opening the butterflies starts the process but you can open the butterflies and the piston might not move, blocking air flow.

Short - maybe the carb pistons are stuck.

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Right now were running the stock 510 carb which I believe is a 2 barrel vacuum secondary carb with an accelerator pump

So one throttle plate and pumping the gas adds fuel...

It also has a glass sided float bowl so you can instantly see if the carb has fuel

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2 hours ago, Patcon said:

So the last couple of times it has done it. When it stalls I told him to just cut it off then restart it. Yesterday when he thought it was acting up he pulled over cut it off and restarted it immediately. Issue was gone...

So that makes me suspect maybe a bad ignition switch or possibly a bad connection causing the loss of voltage at the coil or the matchbox. Thoughts? Ideas on a test to validate this?

I think you might be on to something here Charles.   i am guessing the 510 uses the same ignition switch as the S30 cars.  If you have a good spare,  unplug the the 510's switch and plug in the spare temporarily as a test without mounting it.  Cody can just unplug the spare switch and take it with him as theft protection.

If you need one,  let me know & I can send you one.

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10 minutes ago, S30Driver said:

I think you might be on to something here Charles.   i am guessing the 510 uses the same ignition switch as the S30 cars.  If you have a good spare,  unplug the the 510's switch and plug in the spare temporarily as a test without mounting it.  Cody can just unplug the spare switch and take it with him as theft protection.

If you need one,  let me know & I can send you one.

Thanks Jim! That is an excellent idea. I will look around, I should have more than one...

If not I will let you know

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2 hours ago, Patcon said:

Right now were running the stock 510 carb which I believe is a 2 barrel vacuum secondary carb with an accelerator pump

So one throttle plate and pumping the gas adds fuel...

It also has a glass sided float bowl so you can instantly see if the carb has fuel

So, a plain old carb like most of us raised on domestic cars learned on?

Still, if the throttle plates open the engine should gain RPM.  If there was a blockage in the fuel supply it would go lean and pop or stall.  So timing does seem like a possibility.  Retarded probably.  I learned about retarded timing back when I was just learning the "time by ear" method.  My ear was bad and timing got way off.  Turned a 400 CI Pontiac engine in to a gutless wonder.

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1 hour ago, Mark Maras said:

 Does your 510 have a dual point distributor?

He has replaced the original distributor with an electronic ZX version Mark.

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14 hours ago, Zed Head said:

So, a plain old carb like most of us raised on domestic cars learned on?

Still, if the throttle plates open the engine should gain RPM.  If there was a blockage in the fuel supply it would go lean and pop or stall.  So timing does seem like a possibility.  Retarded probably.  I learned about retarded timing back when I was just learning the "time by ear" method.  My ear was bad and timing got way off.  Turned a 400 CI Pontiac engine in to a gutless wonder.

Yes, basically. It is possible it is a timing issue I probably need to check the vacuum advance and the centrifugal weights too. I don't know how we would watch timing in real time since it is such a sporadic issue

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Ok

So some updates:

We have gotten his car running. We pulled the old 2 barrel carb and replaced it with a set of SSS SU's that I rebuild and replated. The car runs much better and accelerates much better. But, since no good deed goes unpunished, we have a new problem! We are loosing water and over heating! The manifolds have a water passages from the head and connect to a pipe going around the front of the block.

What is the best way for me to narrow down the leak? This is a major leak, like a gallon of water in 10 miles!!! There are no visible leaks that we have found. There is no carpet in the car right now, and we aren't seeing any water in the floor board. My thoughts are manifold passages leaking into the exhaust, a head leak or an external leak that we haven't spotted yet. Any ideas on the best way to go at this? I hate to pull the manifolds again if avoidable. You would think that amount of coolant into the exhaust would be noticeable. I would think it would steam like crazy and probably smell sweet to boot!

 

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A quick check would be to look at plugs so see if a chamber is drinking it... also check oil for chocolate milk.

You can rig up a rad cap to take an air line (or buy one of those pressure test kits with one) and pressurize the system with 13psi.  You may be able to hear the leak.

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A gallon just disappears? It sounds like that thing has become a water pump. Pull the plugs and crank it. Check the oil level. Hope that it’s burning because otherwise somewhere there’s a lot of unwanted juice. Did you check the manifolds, gasket, and head to make sure every hole aligned?

As a side note, you’re going to be in very good company at the Mitty. Make a list of questions, take pictures, and get connected with the Datsun cognescenti ASAP. Knowledgeable, fun people there! Feast on the resources.

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1 hour ago, 240260280 said:

A quick check would be to look at plugs so see if a chamber is drinking it... also check oil for chocolate milk.

You can rig up a rad cap to take an air line (or buy one of those pressure test kits with one) and pressurize the system with 13psi.  You may be able to hear the leak.

I figured checking plugs and compression test would be next. I checked the oil, a little low but doesn't look milky

55 minutes ago, NVZEE said:

A gallon just disappears? It sounds like that thing has become a water pump. Pull the plugs and crank it. Check the oil level. Hope that it’s burning because otherwise somewhere there’s a lot of unwanted juice. Did you check the manifolds, gasket, and head to make sure every hole aligned?

As a side note, you’re going to be in very good company at the Mitty. Make a list of questions, take pictures, and get connected with the Datsun cognescenti ASAP. Knowledgeable, fun people there! Feast on the resources.

I did not check the gasket overly close. I agree that's a lot of fluid going somewhere fast!

Yup, I thought the Mitty would be a good place to make pictures and pick some people for ideas.

It overheated on him the other day, because he forgot to refill it after installing the SU's. So we filled it and he ran it. He drove it 8 miles today to a friends house and it overheated. Was a gallon+ low on water. Filled it and drove it the 8 miles home. Almost 2 gallons low. We ran it for a while tonight with it rev'd and the water level didn't move. There seems to be a tiny bit of oil fill in the radiator...

Edited by Patcon

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I don't know how easy it is see the rear of your engine but are there any water trails on the block at the back of the head?  Just throwing that out because that's where I had head gasket leak on my L28.   Water would just disappear and the engine would start to get hot. I believe it would  only leak with the engine at temp.  Yours would probably be more obvious.

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Sounds like head gasket.

When cold, remove radiator cap and crank engine. It may blow like a geyser if the head gasket is only sealing when hot.

If nothing at start then let the car come up to temp with rad cap off.

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Charles, I can introduce you to Rob Fuller who owns the Z Car Garage (http://www.zcargarage.com) in San Jose. He's here working on the BRE car among others. You might be able to pick his brain. He loves 5 & dimes, too.

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So I pulled the plugs after work

20180427_162049.jpg20180427_162105.jpg

Pig rich and 1 & 4 are wet. Oil wet I believe. We cleaned them good and put them back in. Ran it at idle for 15 minutes or more. Never really warmed up. so I sent him around the block. He overheated in less than a mile turned around and got home. We still haven't looked to see how low it is. Looking for a pressure tester now...

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I just went and did a compression test. I did it cold because I didn't want to run the car anymore until I have a little better hold on what's going on.

#1   135

#2   120

#3   127

#4   135

Not conclusive, as the spread isn't that bad, but the middle two are low. Maybe a leaks in between the middle two?

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