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dat240z71

Overseas sale

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I have my car for sale I have be in contact with a guy from Europe that wants to buy my 240z. I have read about all the scams in those kind of sale has anyone sold a car to someone out of the country before if so what advice can you give me. I told him no wire transfers, no checks for more than the asking price. I was thinking about a cashier check. What we have talked about is he send me chasers check (fedx DHL UPS ) for half the money I will deposit and see if it clears he said he has a friend in Colorado that's getting married in April and when he comes to wedding he will being the other half and make shipping arrangements. I told him he's not getting the car or the title until I have my funds in full in U.S. dollars.What do you guy think.

Edited by dat240z71

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Tell him he'll need to pay off the balance in cash. A cashier's check can be no good. (I'm not talking about forgeries, which can happen too.)

Call your bank to ask them how long you must wait to be dead certain the funds are good for the first half of the payment.

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Why no wired funds? Secure and the money will be your account the next day.

Dean

He's right you don't want to be the sender, but you can receive. PayPal can also be an option. If he has a friend in Colorado maybe he buys the car on books but he gives the money t his friend. Then you have someone in the US if the sale goes bad

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Dean my bank advised me aganist wire transfers, as he would have my banking info. I thought about pay pal but I'm not sure if its safe. He's from Switzerland

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Interest in Classic 240Z's is growing in Europe and the Z's are showing up in more Concours events there.

I've helped a couple of guys in Europe locate and buy 240Z's. One of them came to the 40th Anniversary Celebration of the Z Car this past year in Nashville.

In both cases the buyers had a Broker here in the US that handled paying for the car and then picking it up and shipping it to Europe. The sellers were paid with a Cashiers Check drawn on a US Bank by the Broker, and the car was picked up a few weeks later, well after the checks cleared.

Do you write personal checks for any reason? If you do, anyone that gets them has your banking information - it's printed on all your checks. I don't know why your banker would advise against receiving a wire transfer. Your bank will charge you a small fee for receiving funds and exchanging Euro's to U.S. Dollars - but it will be FAR less than Pay Pal.

If the buyer is willing to send you 1/2 the money and months later, show up with the other half in cash - I don't see any reason not to sell. I agree that you should not release the car or any paperwork until any checks have cleared - and you can withdraw the CASH from your account.

If you have any concerns - just go to another bank - and open a new account for the purpose of receiving the funds - put $50.00 in there to open the account - after the checks clear or the funds arrive - take the cash out and close the account.

FWIW,

Carl B.

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Make sure he knows how much shipping will cost before you complete the sale. Years ago, I 'sold' my Z to someone overseas--he wired me funds--and then found out he was unable to ship the car. Needless to say, I still have my Z.

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I would trust that guy. I dont know why you think Europeans would trick you somehow, if we want Z's, we are ready to pay for it. Swiss people are amongst the most honest people in europe, and most wealthiest also. I remember when i purchased my Z from the states, seller was so suspicious that i was some villain that he made the purchase very hard for me. I tried to wire the money directly to him but i needed his home address in order to do so ( it is required by the bank) but he didnt give it to me, nor to my friend who lives in USA. Eventually my friend have to give the money to US citizen who called the guy and get the address. I needed to pay extra because of this.

All im sayin that, trust us :) We love Z's!!

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I'd just make sure you get most of your money before sending the car. You can't blame a guy if he wants to hold 10-20% to make sure you follow your end. He is putting a greater risk in this sale than you are. You are also working with a very stable country it's not like it some backwater African County with very little control and law.

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The problem is not "Europeans", nor "Swiss people" - - the real problem is that on the Internet you never really know who someone is, nor where he is actually located.

Every year, people here in the US and I'm sure around the world fall for the "Nigerian scams" and lose millions of dollars. Internet Fraud is everywhere - people even routinely get screwed on E-Bay...

It is hard enough to take any legal action when a person is located within your own State here in the U.S. - it is all but impossible to take effective legal action when someone is out of the Country.

It is very understandable that a seller in the U.S. would rather find a buyer in the U.S. if possible. There are far less complications to the transaction.

The bottom line is that you don't have to "trust" anyone, anywhere. Simply set the terms of the sale such that all funds have to be paid-in-full before releasing anything. IMHO the best way to handle that is via an international Funds Transfer via the banking system.... ie. have the buyer wire the money to your bank account. If your worried about it - open another account with a new bank and use that for any and only on-line transactions...

FWIW,

Carl B.

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To echo pretty much what most others think! "NO CAR UNTIL I HAVE ALL CASH IN MY HAND", regardless of method of pay. Buyer is responsible for shipping. Getting half the cash up front is a good idea though since he is coming to the states. But when he arrives only accept CASH! Make it clearly understood before you meet for the final transaction.

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FAIW, I like to meet in banks to do transactions. If a bank is handing out the cash, I can assume it's good. I like to do this whether I'm buying or selling. (I think it's reassuring to the seller when I'm buying -- a show of good faith.) Cashiers' checks are a bit trickier. It's reassuring to be there when the bank issues the check, but it is actually possible to stop payment on a cashier's check. (I don't know under what circumstances this can be done, but it can indeed be done.) For this reason I won't take cashiers' checks. However, when I bought my last car, the seller did ask for a cashier's check, which I had issued in his presence at my bank.

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If you're going to do this then provide him a list of brokers in your area (someone mentioned a broker already). Let him go through the whole process with the broker. You'll only be required to turn over the car, bill of sale and title to the shipper once the broker has made payment to you via the buyers financial institute. It takes all of the risk and hassle out of it for you. I've bought several vehicles overseas and had them shipped here. A broker is required to deal with the shipper, customs and other gov't agencies. I've always used a bank transfer without problems as a buyer.

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Using a broker is no guarantee of honesty either. In many cases all a broker does is cost the buyer more money. The broker has to be paid, and you probably don't want to give him a cut of your share, right? Use the wire transfer method. As was mentioned earlier, every time that you write a check the person that you write it to has your account routing info. There is very little risk to you because you have his money and his car. Several years ago I sold 8-12 cars per month to a dealer in the Netherlands. We always did wire transfer and never had a problem of any sort. The biggest hazard is the fact that Big Brother monitors such transfers to make sure that you're not laundering funds for terrorists or drug cartels. Good luck with your sale. Cheers, Scott

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Hi,

I would advice to be careful about car to be sold overseas. I'm sure also if he's willing to go that route & look serious, he has been involved in some ways with Z clubs somewhere.

I'm a mod on the French board, there're a lot of swiss people there. The buyer might be part of them, I can find info maybe about him. If you have his first name, that would help (last name will not).

Last advice, cashier check are NOT SAFE. You also have to know that you'll get money in your account BEFORE the bank can make sure it's real. Lead time is about 2 weeks to clear the check.

So no matter what, plan for a period of time between money transfer and car shipment if you decide to trust the buyer.

The usual scam from Africa asks you to cash out a cashier check (fake obviously), the buyer alert you the check was too big but he has no other choice and will ask you to send back some of the money thru Western Union. Since the money is in your account, you go for it. One week after the bank remove the money from your account because the cashier check was fake but the money you've sent thru Western Union was real (and gone :( )

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There are real, legitimate, verifiable brokers and not. Do your homework. I have nothing to gain from suggesting escrow.com.

transfers, checks, escrow services, whatever. There are fees associated with all options.

Cash is good. At the end of the day, you have to do what you're at peace with.

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There are indeed many brokers that are legit. And at least that many more who are not. My point is why would you use a broker, who BTW is going to charge someone either you or the buyer 10-15% of the sale price of the vehicle, to do something that you can do yourself. 3 or 4 phone calls to various forwarding companies, and he's 'earned' his commission. Do an online search for forwarding companies. The Tidewater area (Norfolk, VA) is probably going to be the closest major seaport to you. When the car arrives at the forwarder you walk into the office with the vehicle title, tell them that you're dropping it off for shipment to 'Mr. John Doe' in wherever Switzerland, give them John's contact info, a company rep. walks out and verifies the VIN, takes a marker and writes on the windshield J. Doe- Geneva, Switzerland, you roll the car off the trailer and into their holding yard to be loaded on a container... That's it. 15 minutes and you're down and away. The forwarder handles everything from that point on. It could not be easier. There is no Customs paperwork to fill out, nothin', that's it. Now importing a car is a different story, but exporting one is a doodle. Over the years I've exported cars to the Netherlands, the UK and France. Sent a Lotus Europa to Japan and most recently, a Fiat 124 Spider to New Zealand. The places and faces change, but the process remains the same. Just a little FWIW from one who's been there, done that. Cheers, Scott

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+1 for Carl's suggestion. Wire transfers, bank to bank, into a new account. From there you can log into your online banking account and move it to your "regular" account. The purchaser will never know your regular account number and your bank will be able to tell you when it has "cleared".

Best of all, it has most of the benefits of using an escrow account without the fees.

John

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It's reassuring to be there when the bank issues the check, but it is actually possible to stop payment on a cashier's check. (I don't know under what circumstances this can be done, but it can indeed be done.) For this reason I won't take cashiers' checks.

At least at the banks I deal with - Stop Payment Orders can be made at any time before the Cashier's Check has cleared. The issuing bank can check up to the hour to see if it has been presented for payment or not... With a personal check, you have to wait until the following day to see if it cleared the day before or not.

So you can actually stop payment on a Cashier's Check more quickly and assuredly than you can with a personal check.

FWIW,

Carl B.

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The bottom line is that you don't have to "trust" anyone, anywhere. Simply set the terms of the sale such that all funds have to be paid-in-full before releasing anything. IMHO the best way to handle that is via an international Funds Transfer via the banking system.... ie. have the buyer wire the money to your bank account. If your worried about it - open another account with a new bank and use that for any and only on-line transactions...

FWIW,

Carl B.

:) I refer to my previous post. What IF the buyer wont give you any details for transaction? I only now talk about my case and in that case it was matter of TRUST.

Im with ajmcforester in this. We risk a lot more when ordering cars from abroad. I know one 240Z from Texas wich was imported here. It was sold as driveable and when it arrived, engine was blown...

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I sold a 1971 240Z to someone in Norway. I was dubious at first, but he sent me the money (I think with a cashier's check or a money order--I forget exactly which it was). As I said, I was skeptical all the way up until I actually confirmed that I had the dough including shipping cost, which he made the arrangements for. All I had to do was deliver the car to the shipping depot 100 miles away. Strange thing was I never heard from him again, no thank you message...nothing. His English was decent too, in emails of course, we never spoke over the phone. I've lost track of the car, but it would be fun to know what happened to it. Maybe it's registered on Carl Beck's site?

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Thanks for your response guys. Well the gentleman and I talked last week he sent me $1200.00 cash via express mail which I received last Thursday. I took Carl B. advise and talked to my local branch manager told him about the sale. He suggested opening a new account and not link it to my primary account just for the transaction of the sale and I could close the account when the deal wad done. I E-mail the guy on Friday the 18th, he called I give him my banking information and 3 hours later he called me and told he had wired me

$5k. and I should have it Monday or Tuesday, My bank is close today Monday for Presidents day I will find out tomorrow.

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