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saridout

what do yall think of this quote on body and paint?

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i keep my 280 out in the country in my dad's garage, and most everything is cheaper out here, but this seems a little cheaper than normal. i went to a body shop called TCB Riveria in Quinlan, TX. the guy gave my car a cursory look and told me $2500 for both the body work and the paint, or $2000 if i do the disassembly myself. the engine bay has already been done. he says that he doesn't use bondo, he uses some fiber glass product. he said the paint job would involve painting all the door jambs and both sides of the hood, hatch and doors. he showed me a few albums of cars he's done, trophies he's won. he seemed pretty dependable. i'll be sure to look at his work up close before i make a decision, but does this sound too good to be true to yall?

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.....he says that he doesn't use bondo, he uses some fiber glass product.
Don't know if there's really any difference. Bondo is basically two types of plastic, silica, and glass microspheres. Fiberglass is basically the same thing.....plastic filler.

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he mentioned the product by brand name... i can't remember exactly what it was. i'm pretty sure it had "glass" in the name, like X-Glass or something like that.

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What Stephen said. The guy telling you he doesn't use Bondo is like me saying I don't use Kleenex, but use tissues instead. This statement alone gives me the impression that he typically caters to people who aren't knowledgeable in repair work, and may think of Bondo as a cheap fix.

That said, it's still quite possible that he could do fine work. The price does seem low to me, but business may be slow for him now, and a job is a job. I'd ask for references, look at some of his older work, preferably at least 5 years old, to see how it has held up. Also ask him if he is quoting you his top line work, or just the quickie job.

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I had my car painted in June 09 it cost $4,500.00 for the body work and paint in Gulfport, MS by a friend who does it on the side at a body shop. I had other estimates as high as $8,000.00. I was very satisfied with the work that was done. Just my two cents as one who has been through it lately.

Edited by 78zcar_blue

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The main bonding agent in Bondo (which is a trademark name) and Fiberglass (which is often misnamed/misunderstood) is Polyester Resin.

Bondo and other plastic body fillers have Talc as the primary ingredient and the resin as the secondary, there are other additives for flexibility etc.

Fiberglass by itself is the glass strand that is most commonly used in home insulation. In most automotive use and reference, the name refers to the application of fiberglass cloth or strand mat that is saturated on application with Polyester Resin without the talc (although there is a variation sometimes referred to as "Gorilla Hair"; "Gorilla Snot", "Tiger Strand" "DuraGlas" etc.; which uses Bondo and fiberglass strand). One use for this is to build very strong and lightweight panels in hard to stamp or reproduce shapes (vis a vis the original Z sugarscoops). Other times it's for it's strength/weight ratio which is excellent (replacement body panels). Many race cars use it.

With the introduction of "micro-sphere" glass bubbles which have been introduced as part of the bulking agent in Bondo to reduce it's weight per volume additional trade names have been introduced. These plastic body fillers go by the name Ultra-Glass; Feather Weight or other name that exhorts it's "light" weight or glass sphere content. This can give rise to much confusion, as this thread shows.

The confusion between Bondo and Fiberglass is common, due to the similarity of use in reproducing automobile body lines and contours as well as their ease of use and general availability. With the introduction of the glass microspheres the confusion gets worse because people who use the glass sphere product proclaim that they aren't using Bondo (which they are) and mistakenly allude to using Fiberglass when they aren't using any glass strand product.

The main "argument" between Bondo and Fiberglass is that Bondo is known to absorbe moisture over time, whereas the fiberglass mat/strand and resin generally does not. As such, bodymen will deny using Bondo when queried and proclaim to only use fiberglass simply to satisfy the self-avowed expert.

In actual use however, Bondo and other plastic body fillers are very easy to shape and sand. By adding fiberglass strand it gets more difficult, but the strength of the repair goes up. Fiberglass resin and strand alone (no bondo) is extremely hard to sand compared to bondo. I would question any bodyman insisting he only uses fiberglass resin/strand instead of bondo for general bodywork. Each has its use and application method.

What you heard as "glass" may have just referred to one of the lightweight bodyfillers.

Regardless of the above; as Arne mentioned it may be lack of work or, as you pointed out distance to a major urban center that is driving his price. The only way to ascertain his skill and value is to examine one of his prior jobs, if possible and again if possible, talk to the owner. But be careful as to how you ask, he may look at it as your being distrustful and in turn affect his response.

For $2500 you may be getting the bare bones (presuming there isn't any bodywork to be done) or a heck of a deal if there is.

If there IS bodywork to be done, which your remarks prompting the main thread here point to, then you may be opening up a major can of deception or looking a gift horse in the mouth. The guy may just need the work or he's looking to get your car into "paint shop prison".

Only you can discern that difference.

FWIW

E

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Great explanation EScanlon. I have worked with both and they are indeed quite different. That was a great point you had about shops that say they use fiberglass and no bondo. if you were to sand down the fiberglass all the glass strands will start poking out where the resin layer was gone and leave a very rough surface. But by applying a thin layer of bondo you can smooth it all nicely.

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It is not important what filler they use, it IS important what kind of job they will do. Are they going to sand your car and paint it or correct any problems and do a proper job. $ 2500 is OK for a quick repaint but is very inexpensive if you want a nice job. I would want to know that the shop knows what I expect in a paint job and that they are quoting on that. Also, be prepared for extra costs if they find rust. My paint job cost a lot more after the shop repaired a few rust problems that I did not know exhisted before the car was sanded.

Good Luck

Bob M

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What Stephen said. The guy telling you he doesn't use Bondo is like me saying I don't use Kleenex, but use tissues instead.

maybe he was just poo-pooing the brand. i'm definitely going to look at his work before spend anything. i've been trying to find some reviews of him, but that's a problem with these country shops... they have no use for having an internet presence. maybe i'll call around to local car clubs and see if anyone can provide a review.

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wow, thanks E. everything i never knew about body filler :)

i'm pretty sure the body is going to need quite a bit of work. i'm going to, at the very least, visit his shop again. and i'm going to take my dad, who admittedly knows a lot more about body work than i do.

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i've been trying to find some reviews of him, but that's a problem with these country shops... they have no use for having an internet presence. maybe i'll call around to local car clubs and see if anyone can provide a review.
You don't want "reviews", you want references, and previous work you can look at in person. Just ask the guy for references. If he wants your job, he'll give you some names to call. If he can't provide any, look elsewhere.

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What all needs to be done with your car? Is there any rust to treat or dents to fill?

IMO, body fillers like Bondo should only be used to fill the smallest or shallowest of scratches, gouges or dents, used very lightly for contouring the metal (to match other panel shapes or near welds), and any dents should be removed with hand-work first as much as possible.

thxZ

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I am currently having my 72 orange Z painted here in town. There is no rust and very minimal body work required (in my eyes). He is painting under the hood (I have the engine out), door jambs, removing the glass, all of the interior plastic is being pulled, etc, for $3000 including the paint. He told me the brand/type of paint, but it eludes me now. Single phase(?) leaded paint, supposed to be as close to the original as one can get. He grimices at the word bondo but does use a plastic skim coat in places. Apparently he likes something that does the same thing but with a different name. This is a painter that takes a couple of years to get into his shop and he is beyond anal. We met at a bidding war over a 240 in a farmers barn and we both eventually got different Z's. His being a 75 with tripple webbers, and strangely enough, the same color as the stock 240 I picked up. He would never have taken on my car and certainly not for that price without having the Z's in common. It is all about who you know. It will be another 6-8 weeks before I get my car but I am looking forward to that spring drive.

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