Front End Refresh - oh oh

[LeonV]

Thanks for the feedback. I realized that I now have three spare rods in the garage, plus the two on the car, so went out and used the edge of a small adjustable carpenter's square on them. Two are perfectly straight and one is bent. One on the car is very slightly bent, the other perfect. Seems like the bend's only real effect is to pull the end of the transverse link (control arm) back slightly due to a decrease in effective length. Changing the wheel base on side. Something that happens anyway due to the elastic bushings on the end of the TC rod and the elastic in the inner bushing. The factory front suspensions on these cars seem to be pretty flexible. The only time the wheels are properly aligned would be when cruising straight down a level smooth road.

Caster angle is also changed, magnitude depending on the severity of the bend.

[Zedyone_kenobi]

Correct, I rolled mine on a flat piece of bench and one wobbles the other is dead flat when it rolls.

Gnose, I agree with what you say, but having adjustment of the length of the LCA, plus adjustment of the TC rod, I just figured I could honk something up. But you are correct with just let an alignment shop do it. I just figured purchasing one from a member was a much more cost effective way to solve my problem. If I were to start making my car a more dedicated track car, I will have to revisit both the front and back of the car. AZC may get a call.

[cbuczesk]

It's boxed up and on the front porch ready for USPS Priority Mail delivery.

Chuck

[Zedyone_kenobi]

Thanks so much Chuck! You really went above and beyond buddy.

[ZCurves]

... I keep it mopped and shined up before during and after every job. In about 3 weeks there will be an engine/tranny swap....

A well placed refrigerator box will save you a bunch of consternation. When you are all finished 90 percent of the debris gets folded up with the cardboard...

[cbuczesk]

A well placed refrigerator box will save you a bunch of consternation. When you are all finished 90 percent of the debris gets folded up with the cardboard...

Yeah, I used to do that. But the cost of buying a new refrigerator every month made it kind of expensive.

Chuck

[Zedyone_kenobi]

HAHAHA

I just just buy simple green by the gallon! hahah

[Zedyone_kenobi]

Okay guys, I am nearing the point where I want to start putting my Z back together, and while cleaning off the steering knuckles I thought to myself, 2 things.

1) Now would be a really crazy ideal time to install the quick steering knuckles

and

2) Since I am running 15" wheels, and MSA sells bump steer spacers that are suppose to correct for this 'misalignment' due to lowered cars, (tokiko springs and struts), are they really necessary?

Has anybody else used either of these products?

[Zedyone_kenobi]

Well I said the hell with it, I ordered the quick steering knuckles but NOT the bump steer spacers. I could not find any reviews of them and whether they will really help. My car is not THAT much lower than stock, so while my LCA in front are not in OEM position when the car is still, I cannot imagine it is enough to really screw anything up. But I will keep searching for any reviews.

I also ordered some rubber bushings for the TC rods. I have the ball/socket kit, but the poly bushings I had are just do darn hard, I wondered if I could get the correct length using the little spacer. Today I spent the day with a grinder and some VHT chassis black.

[Zedyone_kenobi]

Last night I spent a couple of hours cleaning bolt threads and washers. Not the most glamorous work, but pays dividends in the long run when it comes time to reassemble.

[Bonzi Lon]

I'll second that.

Bonzi Lon

[cbuczesk]

I'll third that!

Ar eyou removing the ball/socket TC kit? If so, I'd be interested buying it. I have that setup on my race car and wouldn't mind having a better set.

Chuck

[Zedyone_kenobi]

No I am installing the ball/socket set. I am removing the hardened poly bushings on both sides of the TC rod.

[cbuczesk]

Keep an eye on the plastic part. It seems to break easily. :-(

Chuck

[Zedyone_kenobi]

Great! If it breaks, then techno tuning will be getting a call. But for now, I am going to keep the faith.

[cbuczesk]

I think I have 4 damaged/broken ones at home. They must wear very quickly. Keep in mind that mine were used on a race car. They were used hard but not often. I really think that something like that should last a long time. I'll try to post some pictures tonight. I'm not sure that I'd want them on my street car.

About the bump steer spacers... I just put them on my race car. It's lowered to about 5.25" from the ground to the bottom of the rocker not to the pinch weld. The other guys racing Zs use them. I'm racing this weekend and will let you know if they made a difference.

Chuck

[Marty Rogan]

Okay guys, I am nearing the point where I want to start putting my Z back together, and while cleaning off the steering knuckles I thought to myself, 2 things.

1) Now would be a really crazy ideal time to install the quick steering knuckles

and

2) Since I am running 15" wheels, and MSA sells bump steer spacers that are suppose to correct for this 'misalignment' due to lowered cars, (tokiko springs and struts), are they really necessary?

Has anybody else used either of these products?

My yellow track car had the quick steering knuckles, and they made a big difference. I liked them a lot. The car was maybe an inch or so lowered and I did not use the bump steer spacers. I did not notice any ill effects from that.

As far as the poly bushings for the TC rod, I would recommend what I did. Put a polly bushing in the front to retain stiffness. Put a stock rubber bushing on the back side of the TC Rod where the hex nut goes on. This will also help to prevent the TC Rod from breaking, as has been reported when using the polly bushings at both ends.

Marty

[Mike W]

Chuck,

I have a brand new ball / socket setup for the TC rods that I am not going to use and would be willing to let it go. I opted for the TTT adjustable rods instead so this is no longer needed. Still in the bag.

PM me if you are interested and I'm sure we can work something out.

Mike.

[Zedyone_kenobi]

Chuck I got your parts, Thanks very much, they look splendid! You are a great man sir. My Z thanks you!

[Zedyone_kenobi]

I started to get parts bolted back up, but had a miserable time of it.

The two bolts that hold the ball joint onto the transverse link require 35 to 45 ft lbs. Well at exactly 40 one snapped off and the other was just about to.

Then the washer that goes to the bolt that holds the steering knuckle to the shock body cracked in half.

Man these parts after being compressed for so many years, are so darn brittle! I will replace anything M8 and below from now on with new cad plated hardware. All my cleaning and polishing bolts was futile, as now I am going to replace everything.

crack on me once, shame on you

crack on me twice, shame on me!

I did manage to get my transverse link installed and torqued to 90 ft lbs though. The poly bushings sure look better in there than the worn out stockers.

[tlorber]

You may want to check those torque settings. If it's the bolts I'm thinking of, my Haynes manual said 40 # which was way too much. I stretched the bolts and had to replace them. I retorqued to 15# I think.

[Zedyone_kenobi]

Well I hear ya, but if the manual says 40 lbs, why should I second guess it? 40 did rip it right off. I will shoot for 35 this evening when I get some more hardened bolts built in the last 30 years.

[Zedyone_kenobi]

UPDATE

I am half way done. I managed to get the bolts tightened to 35 ft lbs on the ball joint, which is the lower amount called out in the FSM. I then removed it and compared the length and no permanent set had occurred. Threads looked clean. So I left it at 35 and smiled and walked away. I plan to have the car rolling again by this weekend. Is there a desired amount of toe in/castor, I should have the alignment shop dial in. Camber is pretty much fixed.

[tlorber]

FSM calls for 1/16"-7/32" toe in. You cannot adjust camber or castor with stock components. Beyond being just plain embarrasing at the alignment shop "What do you mean you can't adjust castor on these cars?" I still don't understand why they did not engineer that in, but since you've already bought the parts I won't go back down that road.

[Zedyone_kenobi]

Job is complete except for getting the alignment done. I may just try to do it myself There is only one nut turn on each side. Anyway, she is ready to drive until my engine gets here, but that is another thread!